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Thread: American Staffordshire Terrier

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keira & Phoenix View Post
    We are not saying don't have an opinion or don't have an opinion unless it is the same as ours, we are saying if you are going to have one and state it aloud then please make it an EDUCATED opinion based on proper research and facts.

    I am happy to have an informed discussion, key word being informed, it is pointless having a discussion if one party does not want to have an educated view.


    This sentence is stated as a question and yet you have said you don't want to educate yourself.
    How can we answer this question if you don't want to be educated and learn something....
    There are many members here, me included who could tell you WHY this law was created and why THIS breed was targeted (and why before Pitbulls, breeds such as the German Shepherds, Dobes, Rotties and Bloodhounds were targeted) and why BSL does not work, and in fact V+F has already told you a bit. But unless you are willing to read what we say and take it in it is pointless.
    i am reading what ur saying and taking it in, i am not a closed minded bigot actually..i see all aspects of this debate but it seems you guys just want to focus on one "wrong" thing i say and ostracize me for it..i dont know how many times ive had to say " I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST PITTYS PERSONALLY" but yet you say silly things like.."quote"
    "aww elle your the lady who lives next door and wants to run my dogs out of town arnt you?" i mean really?...
    its your OPINION that im not educated, because you believe ur opion is right so much that i must be an idiot to not 100% agree with everything ur saying, i get that...i actually respect that ur that passionate about a cause but surely u can accept that others may have a differant take on some things ur saying be it right or wrong? mate, all i was saying was i, personally wouldnt buy a dog that laws were in place that i couldnt do the things id want to do with my dog ie. take to off leash park beach ect, have to muzzel and keep caged etc etc...because of the laws already in place, yes i have doubts that the gov just decided to pick on pittys for NO REASON, having doubts about something doesnt mean i agree with it, in saying that i would like to form my own conclusion rather than being railroaded by some ppl with highly invested veiws

  2. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by elle.burns View Post
    i am reading what ur saying and taking it in, i am not a closed minded bigot actually..i see all aspects of this debate but it seems you guys just want to focus on one "wrong" thing i say and ostracize me for it..i dont know how many times ive had to say " I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST PITTYS PERSONALLY" but yet you say silly things like.."quote"
    "aww elle your the lady who lives next door and wants to run my dogs out of town arnt you?" i mean really?...
    its your OPINION that im not educated, because you believe ur opion is right so much that i must be an idiot to not 100% agree with everything ur saying, i get that...i actually respect that ur that passionate about a cause but surely u can accept that others may have a differant take on some things ur saying be it right or wrong? mate, all i was saying was i, personally wouldnt buy a dog that laws were in place that i couldnt do the things id want to do with my dog ie. take to off leash park beach ect, have to muzzel and keep caged etc etc...because of the laws already in place, yes i have doubts that the gov just decided to pick on pittys for NO REASON, having doubts about something doesnt mean i agree with it, in saying that i would like to form my own conclusion rather than being railroaded by some ppl with highly invested veiws
    How can you form your own conclusions when you have stated that you don't want to get educated......
    The only conclusion you can form is an uneducated, incorrect one.

    I think you will find that V+F apologised for her statement on your profile. Maybe go check that out.

    AS I said I can tell you WHY the government decided to pick on this breed. And why in the past other breeds have also been banned.
    Those breeds have had the bans overturned and many are now thought of as great family pets but still treated as "dangerous" dogs by some.
    You do know that previously Dobermans, German Shepherds, Rottweilers have all been banned breeds.....yet none are anymore...

    To be honest all you seem to be doing is focusing on the fact that some of us have gotten a little over zealous/passionate and you can't see past that now.
    You have not responding to much of what I have said in my last post, you overlooked it to have a jab about what another member said to you.

  3. #73
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    yes i just saw that msg, sorry to villian, as i am new to forums i didnt see that until id already posted so thankyou V&F
    i appreciate that

  4. #74
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    Elle, no one is calling YOU uneducated or a bigot or anything. But your last post (now one but last ) shows that you do not clearly know what breed specific legislation (BSL) is about at all. And I think I am not the only one who finds it a bit frustrating that you said straight out that you don't want to educate yourself on it - like read the other posts on the topic and the many informative links that they contain. I didn't know anything about it before I joined this forum and I'm really glad that learnt about it and can now form an opinion based on facts and common sense.

    I live in the ACT and we are one of the three states/territories that do not have BSL. We do not have more dog bite incidents and we also don't get people massively adopting pitties because they can. It's a non issue really.

  5. #75
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    I didnt mean i didnt want to be educated i just think ppl saying im uneducated because i dont fully agree with their veiws is wrong and its belittling to be told to "go educate yourself" or "your opinion would count if u were educated"..
    sometimes ppl will NEVER agree doesnt make one or the other LESS educated right or wrong..its a debate, its like anything else abortion, religion, sex... theres many differing veiws sometimes theres no right or wrong side., just angles and veiws

  6. #76
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    I think you are really taking the education comments completely the wrong way, which probably also explains why you feel personally attacked. I don't want to be boring and quote from previous posts to show how we got to use that phrase. But what we meant is that you might have a different opinion - or at least be able to back up your opinion with facts - if you would read up on this specific issue. "Educate yourself on breeds specific legislation and the pitbull issue". Nothing to do with you as a person or your level of education or whatever.

  7. #77
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    Perhaps this is a better way to explain where I am coming from:

    BSL has the capacity to create discrimination against specific breeds whilst not protecting the community one iota. There have been numerous breeds discriminated against over the years- some of which might surprise some people:
    Newfoundlands (sorry Newfsie, am not rubbing it in!)
    Bloodhounds
    German Shepherds
    Dobermanns
    And now the Pitbull.

    In Italy, 90+ breeds were declared as 'restricted' before the Italian government realized that BSL was not working.

    I am a member of a small group actively involved in presenting scientific evidence to the Victorian government to show that this type if legislation does not reduce dog bites/ homicides and actually increases the risks to the general public. One member of our group attended Ayen Chol's funeral and actually spoke with Mr Chol, her father. The group extended our sincere condolences at his tragic loss and followed up with a discussion about the current laws and the facts that these new laws as they stand do nothing to protect our community. Mr Chol, to his absolute credit understood and was able to see that the government had not enacted legislation to protect children/ the community from further tragedies such as the attack on his daughter.

    If a father suffering from such a loss can see that these laws do not do as they are supposed to, one thinks that our lawmakers should also be able to understand this. As a group, we support the notion of a scientific and evidence based program (such as the Calgary Model) to enforce responsible dog ownership and thus actually have a chance at minimizing the occurrence of dog bites and attacks.

    Unfortunately, as the legislation now stands, and with the objections falling on deaf ears, there is a very real future potential for any breed (but particularly any large breed) to be discriminated against by the same laws- laws that have not worked anywhere else in the world- and could eventually include any dog over arbitrary height and weight limits.
    This is the true reality that the general public do not understand... And a reality that every single dog owner needs to understand.

    If this isn't fought against now... The fallout has the potential to impact too many unwitting and unprepared innocent dog owners.

    ETA: @ Elle... No, these days I would not go out and buy a breed subject to these laws... But what happens when down the track the breed you already own becomes subject to these laws?
    Last edited by Villain & Flirtt; 01-09-2012 at 10:35 PM. Reason: Typos :-(

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