yes we do our name is ruby red place
Perhaps we've been looking at this whole thing wrong - maybe it shouldn't be about who can breed dogs, maybe it should be about who can own them? Like when you want to adopt children, how you have to go through the whole long process of interviews and recommendations and whatever else. It'd certainly take out the problem of impulse buying and the whole "puppy for Christmas" thing!!!
You'd have to pass some sort of test before you'd be approved for ownership and sign some sort of legally binding declaration that you wouldn't breed your dog....
My fantasy world is a nice place to live LOL.
I just checked that rescue site out, and yeah, the statistics out of almost 1800 look very different.
Ok so as far as your concerned as long as YOU are happy with peoples aims to crossbreed and in your opinion doing so with a final aim in mind its ok?
I mean the website you linked us to clearly shows thier aim was to "fulfil a long awaited dream to fill a niche"
Now that sounds like the values everyone has been preaching around here.
this thread is geting intsing i hope it dos not go bad
Fact is, most (barring probably less than 15) modern breeds of dogs have been constructed by people for whatever reason they chose during the last thousand years. Some more recent, and some older. But they were bred from base stock with a specific purpose in mind. Not trying to fill a marketable place for somebody, but trying to fill a need or desire of people. Not all these breeds were developed for work, many, many breeds were developed for companionship in whatever form the breeder chose.
What you have chosen to ignore, and what I have gone to lengths to point out, is that the wastage of dogs created by developing a new breed in this day and age is bordering on socially unacceptable. This means that the process is long, arduous and expensive and cannot be undertaken lightly. But as you are showing a lack of willingness to see that point I won't go into it further.
There are people out there working to standardise or gain recognition for many, many new and not so new breeds. Silkens are but one. There are Murray Valley Curly Coated Retrievers, Australian Bull Arabs, Australian Bulldogs, Australian Koolies etc etc etc. And that is just Australia.
How recently as the Australian Stumpy Tailed Cattle Dog given recognition? Or the Tenterfield Terrier? But have they been created for financial gain with no regard for the welfare of the breeding animals within that breed? Oodles and Doodles and cav or pug-a-liers or jack spaniels or whatever other mutt that is being churned out and flogged off to unsuspecting or ignorant people have. Money. Not even to fill a niche as companion or working animals. Money.
And who wears the suffering at the end? The dogs. So there is no point arguing with you about it, as they still have no voice. And if you cannot listen to those who try to speak for them you are wasting people's time.
Peter...are you paying attention? Back in this thread...this whole debate started when you mentioned your Neo boy wasn't desexed. I asked you the question whether he is on Main or Limited register, which you have not answered as of yet! People started talking about irresponsible breeding like...BYB, Puppy mills, registered breeders breeding for the wrong reasons, people breeding cross/designer breeds for profit...irresponsible dog ownership when you do not desex your dog/bitch etc. I said...there is no reason to breed cross breeds and/or breed with dogs/bitches who do NOT comply with the particular standard!
So I did your research for you regarding the "pure bred" large dogs on PetRescue. The first 10 pages (100 dogs)...52 dogs were "pure breeds"! Out of those dogs...39 dogs are Greyhounds. Greyhounds in general are not bred to be PETS!!!!! NOW...here it becomes interesting! So out of 52 dogs....I would "assume" that the remaining 13 "purebred" dogs out of 100 were bred to be pets. NOW...are you following me...that means....13% of the LARGE dogs were bred as pets...39% were bred for racing and not as pets initially (in most cases). That the Greyhounds are on the list can only be mostly due to them not performing as racing dogs and/or are getting too old!
NOW...it get even more interesting...out of those 13 "purebreds"...how many of them are REGISTERED with the Governing Body eg Dogs NSW, which means...they come from a registered breeder? If a dog was listed on PetRescue and they had registration papers...I am 100% sure that would be mentioned in the dog's intro as an insentive for potential buyers.
So...where did these "purebreds" come from? Yep...you guessed right...from BYB's, irresponsible registered breeders and/or Puppy mills. ANYBODY can breed a "purebred"...your Beagle mates the neighbours Beagle and HURRAY you have Beagle puppies...this is BYB and irresponsible, selfish and unnessecary on so many levels!
NOW...a registered breeder who breeds mainly for profits...not taking into account what is best for the breed and therefore best for the puppies....is also a BYB and if he mass-produces pups...he is still a Puppy mill! This is the same with people breeding Blue Staffy pups...purely for the colour because they know they can get up to $2500 for ONE puppy...they are irresponsible! Or people breeding Rottweilers with "natural Bobtails". Natural Bobtails carry a mutated gene which is linked to Spina Bifida but people STILL breed them because they can get 1000's and 1000's of dollars for ONE bobtail Rottweiler since tail docking has been banned!
There are "purebreds" and then there are registered purebreds who were bred by responsible, ethical breeders!!!
If ALL cross breeding was stopped...if Pet shops were banned from selling dogs...if irresponsible breeders (registered or not) were massively fined...we wouldn't have this debate! The ratio of abandoned animals and animals PTS every year would be significantly reduced!!!
Now pick out some little inane piece of information in this post and bark up another wrong tree with it.
ETA: People who work to produce new breeds...do it with research and a goal in mind. They don't just cross this and that because they can. They research what particular traits they want in the breed and research...research...research! It is done over a long period of time and can take a long time to get the breed registered with the ANKC. There is a BIG difference between breeding cross breeds from your backyard and the people who put in time...money etc to produce dogs that are perfect for...lets say...the Australian climate!
Last edited by Cleasanta; 12-26-2009 at 07:41 AM.
I see it was ok for you to use greyhounds in your original percentages?
I thought a purebred in the pound is a purebred in the pound. Are you saying greyhounds arent a purebred?
So you agree with Nattylou then that its ok to xbreed to create a dog for a "niche".
Now go back and read my posts, the only reason i have kept this going is because of the way the pompous few around here feel they are the only ones entitled to an opinion. My opinion is no different to yours except desexing and until it comes to belittling/ berating and being just plain nasty to someone and bomarding them with your view.
You guys constantly demand facts of others yet provide very few yourself, by this i mean "FACTS" not self absorbed opinions. Drop your qualifications on the table and you may be taken serious.
Figures are a beautiful thing and can be manipulated by anyone to assist them in thier arguments.
As for Nero i believe he is on the main register, he wont be desexed at anytime soon.
Enjoy bathing in your self righteousness this is over and out for me on this subject, your arguments have achieved nothing with me as mine with you. I know myself to be a responsible dog owner and despite your opinions will remain to be one.
I think you should put down some homeless dogs/puppies sometime Peter.
Education not Legislation
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