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Thread: Early age desexing

  1. #11
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    Nev - I got my puppy from AWL so not much choice there.

    If we do have problems with competing - then my next dog - I will definitely go get one directly from the breeder and not desex until she's older. But if I have no problems, I will take my chances at AWL again. There are so many farm dog bitsas there - perfect for dog sports - that need good homes. Getting a 10 week old puppy was a fluke. Ie she wasn't what I went out there to look at.

    What is "CL's" ? Do you mean busted knees (ACLs)? I had one of those and I haven't been desexed. But that doesn't mean anything scientifically. I thought the dangers were more to do with bones than tendons.

  2. #12
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    Are breeders contracts set up by the individual breeder or is it a ANKC thing. I've misplaced mine and cant remeber.

    I find it strange they want me to desex at 6 months for a giant breed. But going of what i've read and heard since this isnt in the best intrests of the dog.
    Just wondering ??


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  3. #13

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    I was just reading the descriptions of desexing at 7 weeks, from cavalierqld and thinking, what a pity I wasn't done... Blast!!

    You've convinced me - but I can't see how any rescue group can hold out for preferably 14 months. 6 months... but I have seen people swear they will desex at 6 months, with a puppy, and then you discover they decided to let her have the experience of being a mother, and I, as a non violent, left wing, middle aged woman go off wishing I could give them all an experience of some big bloke giving them a smack - and that isn't even one of the puppies I cared for. Even paying in advance doesn't help. They will do it, after a litter and you point out if everyone thought the same... and they just give you the vacant smile of self interest and don't care..... Aah!!... Another reason I'm so glad I always tried to rescue older dogs...

  4. #14
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    Katy did her cruciate and she was not desexed until 14 days ago at nearly 3.........But there is some evidence. Definitely dog do get osteoporosis, just like women do if they have their ovaries removed and that can lead to a lot of bone/orhto related issues.......There are so many reasons for all of those hormones besides breeding.

    Cruciate's are often a sports injury, many active very energetic dogs get this, just like a lot os footballers, sprinters, net ballers and so on...Katy did hers just that way a turing injury, going flatchat.......

    I have spent a lot of study time on cruciates and giant bone related problems...Went to a few OS lectures and Seminars too. there is just so much out there (information).

    Personally I will always wait till later, I have never had an accidental litter.......I think it is another one of those things that we all have a personal view on, and so we should...each to his own
    Pets are forever

  5. #15
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    Sean

    Breeder contracts are a breeder thing, and they can vary from breeder to breeder. I'm not sure they're enforceable - legally. Co-ownership sort of works better but if the breeder sells the dog to you outright with a contract signed by you about what you will do after the sale - I don't know that they can actually enforce it, which is why some choose to de-sex before they home the dog.

    I guess I could make that deal with the breeder - that they own the dog until it's desexed and then I own it... so I could wait on the desex.

    There are a lot of benefits to early desex - as there are benefits to delayed desex. There aren't many (any) benefits to having a litter of puppies for the mum dog and a lot of nasty health risks. There is benefit for the breed - as long as the parent dogs are good examples of the breed in form and temperment.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyacinth View Post
    What is "CL's" ? Do you mean busted knees (ACLs)? I had one of those and I haven't been desexed. But that doesn't mean anything scientifically. I thought the dangers were more to do with bones than tendons.
    Lmao Hyacinth-
    The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mohandas Gandhi

  7. #17
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    Harley and Bella were both desexed at around one and a half years old. If I had my time again I would have done them at 6 months old.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  8. #18

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    I think cruciates are actually another herditary problem, weak ligaments seem to run in certain lines. Of course it can just happen at random, but I have known certain breeding lines to be prone to problems.

    I prefer to desex bitches after their first season, my girl was done at around 12 months. I know several breeders who desex puppies before sale at 10 weeks (to be sold at 12 weeks) but they are considered "high risk" breeds such as Staffies where it's hard to trust buyers and they have been burned before by people promising to desex or not breed when they went ahead and did it anyway.

    I have a bitch with urinary incontinence but it started before she was spayed. Infact that was the reason she was spayed as obviously she was not going to be bred from (not that a problem like incontinence would stop some people *sigh*).

  9. #19

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    Hyacinth, If we desexed our kids at 12 weeks we would not have the population issues we have?

    Yes CL is ACL. According to Chris Zinc, the effect of early desexing is a lengthening of the bones in the legs which changes the normal angels and deflections on the joints. This means the ligaments are at angles that are no longer conducive to the types of physical activity they were designed for, and are more prone to damage.
    It does not mean they will rupture, just that they are at a higher risk of doing so, and it does depend on the amount of work you do with the dog.
    Dogs who do heavy work loads and who were not desexed early can also rupture their cruciates. My now departed red border, Flame, who had 2 litters before being desexed, lived for agility, competed in as many events, with multiple runs as we could get to. She ruptured her cruciate chasing a tennis ball on flat ground.
    Nev Allen
    Border River Pet Resort

  10. #20
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    Hyacinth, If we desexed our kids at 12 weeks we would not have the population issues we have?
    If we desex them before they leave home at least... LoL - personally I think all welfare aid, food aid - motel rooms - etc should come with freely available birth control - ie make it really easy for people to use it, so it's easier for them to plan when they want to have children instead of the huge number of unwanted pregancies and in some cases - children - that we have now. I wouldn't go as far as making it mandatory, just easy.

    Yes CL is ACL. According to Chris Zinc, the effect of early desexing is a lengthening of the bones in the legs which changes the normal angels and deflections on the joints. This means the ligaments are at angles that are no longer conducive to the types of physical activity they were designed for, and are more prone to damage.
    what does this mean across different breeds with different leg lengths or even the same breed (eg BCs or Kelpies) with different leg lengths among the different lines. Makes sense that there is also a genetic component.

    My now departed red border, Flame, who had 2 litters before being desexed, lived for agility, competed in as many events, with multiple runs as we could get to. She ruptured her cruciate chasing a tennis ball on flat ground.
    Susan Garrett - my fav agility guru at the moment, recommends against chucking tennis balls for agility dogs. She's seen too many trash themselves phsyically doing it.
    Fido Fitness | Susan Garrett's Dog Training Blog

    Frosty - for some reason - does not nose dive bomb tennis balls like the dog in that video.
    Last edited by Hyacinth; 05-10-2012 at 08:18 PM.

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