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Thread: Show dog questions.

  1. #21
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    there is a difference between purebred and pedigree.

    All dogs have the potential to carry genetic disease, pedigree or not. It's just we seem to pick on pedigree dogs in particular because they conform to a type and people are honest about problems that may exist. Buy a mutt and people tend to put the problems down to sheer bad luck in that individual dog, as the rest of the family is know known or heard from again.

    As for hip dysplaysia that is a polygenic condition. There are many genes that contribute to it, and it's not only large-giant breeds that can suffer from it. The little ones are not as heavy and hence don't usually show problems. Just like larger dogs can also suffer luxating patellas, something people consider a toy dog problem. HD has also become a fashion to an extent with a LOT of veterinarians giving the diagnosis on sight/touch/poor x-rays. It's still something that needs diagnosing by a specialist vet unless the dog is so far gone like my rottweiler and GSD were.
    Heart defects can also show up in any dog, and ear problems in cockers need not necessarily be a genetic 'disease' ... diet and maintenance can go a long way in prevention.

    If you do your homework your chance of getting a dog with problems is low. Like I said the people I know with pedigree dogs and mine included, don't have issues. My pedigrees are the most low maintenance when it comes to health. The ones that have had a reduced life span have been poorly bred, yes even the 'purebreed' ones. I know where a few came from and the fact they died younger then they should have was no surprise to me.

  2. #22
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    Of course lay the blame at the feet of those people who enjoy showing purebreds dogs and perhaps breeding them. We are the people who have ruined the purebred dog all for the sake of ribbons and crappy show prizes. None of us could breed a healthy dog to save our selves, we just want them pretty.

    Only people who don't show should breed, because only they are interested in healthy dogs.

    Yep that's a sure fire way of fixing everthing.

    As for the RSPCA and vets. I don't have a lot of time for the RSPCA and as for many vets, well the one that misdiagnosed by Borzoi over the weekend and could of cost him his life should be shot.

  3. #23
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    Numbers/statistics whatever you want to call them are hard to place next to anything other than purebred dogs.
    Last edited by MAC; 03-18-2012 at 07:39 PM.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by 99bottles View Post
    The fact is the books were closed for a lot of breeds before testing was even available. They are now so closely related that they would be considered endangered species if they were separate species - but that's the price we pay for having the puppies come out near identical to the parents.
    This is a really good point. The closure of books and genetic registries for so long has limited,and continues to limit the genetic diversity in many breeds. The smaller the genetic diversity within a breed the more prone theyto genetic diseases and conditions. And then even good breeders are reducing this even further when dogs die without passing on their genetic heritage, or when breeders split litters selling some off as pets to be neutered.

    Science is saying the only fool proof way to correct shrinking gene pools and increase the healthiness of breeds into the future is to inject some new genes via outcrossing.

    Do you know if any breed clubs in Australia... have opened their books in the past , or plan too?
    Is there any data as to which breeds are the most seriously affected by inbreeding depression, and which breeds enjoy a healthy and diverse gene pool?
    Last edited by cavalierqld; 03-18-2012 at 08:35 PM. Reason: Spelling again, oops
    The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by cavalierqld View Post
    Do you know if any breed clubs in Australia... have opened their books in the past , or plan too?
    ?
    Besides the working breeds, police, guide dogs, assistance etc.
    The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mohandas Gandhi

  6. #26
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    Are you aware that breeders who register their litters are not able to inbred anymore?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC View Post
    Are you aware that breeders who register their litters are not able to inbred anymore?
    But, isnt it OK to line breed? Which is technically still inbreeding, just nto as closely related.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nekhbet View Post
    there is a difference between purebred and pedigree.

    All dogs have the potential to carry genetic disease, pedigree or not. It's just we seem to pick on pedigree dogs in particular because they conform to a type and people are honest about problems that may exist. Buy a mutt and people tend to put the problems down to sheer bad luck in that individual dog, as the rest of the family is know known or heard from again.

    As for hip dysplaysia that is a polygenic condition. There are many genes that contribute to it, and it's not only large-giant breeds that can suffer from it. The little ones are not as heavy and hence don't usually show problems. Just like larger dogs can also suffer luxating patellas, something people consider a toy dog problem. HD has also become a fashion to an extent with a LOT of veterinarians giving the diagnosis on sight/touch/poor x-rays. It's still something that needs diagnosing by a specialist vet unless the dog is so far gone like my rottweiler and GSD were.
    Heart defects can also show up in any dog, and ear problems in cockers need not necessarily be a genetic 'disease' ... diet and maintenance can go a long way in prevention.

    If you do your homework your chance of getting a dog with problems is low. Like I said the people I know with pedigree dogs and mine included, don't have issues. My pedigrees are the most low maintenance when it comes to health. The ones that have had a reduced life span have been poorly bred, yes even the 'purebreed' ones. I know where a few came from and the fact they died younger then they should have was no surprise to me.
    Agree with what you have posted. What I was posting is just a really basic example. In regards to the ear issue, npe not especially breed specific, but extremely common in cockers. Same could be said for allergies or skin issues in partiocular, not breed spcific but very common in staffies. Anyway, like I said, it was just a basic basic exmple and other people will have had different experiences. However, I dont just see the "cross breed" side of things. I am able to view it from both sides and I think my post was very unbiasd.

    In regards to the difference between purebred and pedigree - to me it is paper.

    I use the following as a rough guide:

    Pedigree - parents are same breed with papers showing ancestry all of same breed
    Purebred - parents are same breed but no papers (or you might like to call it proof)

    When I refer to a purebred, I personally am talking about dogs whose lineage is all the same breed, regardless of whether they have papers or not.
    Last edited by Lala; 03-18-2012 at 09:32 PM.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC View Post
    Are you aware that breeders who register their litters are not able to inbred anymore?
    I was under the impression that restriction on 1st degree matings were "in discussion" and any restriction on 2nd degree matings they feel is not warranted at this time.

    Are you talking ANKC Mac?
    The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mohandas Gandhi

  10. #30
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    Lala, Sean, Bottles,Found this read i think you may find interesting, it seems to me to be a well balanced blueprint for change. I think its American but the same principles apply here.

    Purebred Dog Breeds into the Twenty-First Century: Achieving Genetic Health for Our Dogs - 5
    The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mohandas Gandhi

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