View Poll Results: Should dog owners keep their unleashed dogs from invading the space of leashed dogs?

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  • Unleashed dogs should not be allowed to approach leashed dogs

    16 80.00%
  • unleashed dogs should be able to approach leashed dogs

    5 25.00%
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Thread: How Far Should an Offleash Dog or Dogs Go Before Our Leashed Dogs Should React?

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dakota_Chey View Post
    Let me get this right, you and other members allow my posts? On a thread, not the vent thread, that I basically initiated and set a poll? If I am unabated perhaps I would not have had to repeat myself. I notice the occurs with others posts, thats okay? The post from sweetboy explains how his dog was on leash and mauled. Where are any of your comments regarding, that he can't control his dog and keep his dog safe? No that's right, there are none. Same situation, different post-no comments or condemnation. By the way, beliggerance is one stating that they basically permit another to have part in something at their discretion. That is not your decisions to make, so perhaps you could move onto other threads, as I have done myself and still came across one of you who went out of their way to follow me to a redundant thread just to mock me. One of those you support actually, Hyacinth. Check that out! oh and I have not been in to any nutrition threads but dare say that sweetboy speaks the truth.
    Dakota, I've been pretty good at glossing over the ****fight, but it seems that you are not taking the chance to pull back when others are giving it. You are becoming to close to the argument and losing your perspective.

    Trust me, it doesn't work. You need to pull back, make a coffee (tea, stiff scotch.... whatever your chosen poison may be), gain some perspective and then move on.


    The internet is hard for fellow passionates like you, me and AngelanBatty and the others!
    A pessimist sees the glass as half empty;
    An optimist sees the glass as half full;
    A realist just finishes the damn thing and refills it.

  2. #92
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    I havent read all the arguing so I am just goign to comment on the poll itself.

    My dogs, unfortunately, are not "bomb proof". As a result. I do not walk my dogs off lead unless we are somewhere it is safe to do so (i.e. in N we used to do this often at the beach and river - noone round ever). Pippi (my little dog)) has never in her whole 2 year been walked off lead as her recall still needs lots of improvement.

    I dont think an offlead dog should be able to rush an onlead dog at all. Off lead dog owners shoudl think that perhaps there is a reason the dogs are on lead in the first place.

    If a dog approached us with any aggressiveness at all, my large dog would not even hesitate to rip it to pieces. Despite being a big wuss. Luckily, he is large, black and boofy so when people see him they generally put the lead on their off lead dogs.

    In regards to small dogs and picking them up. I find this one difficult. My small dog is highly dog aggressive. I dont know why she just is (though she is improving and can now sit on the porch and watch a dog walk past without going crazy). She will lunge at dogs if she gets close enough. If they are onlead its not an issue for her to get a bit aggro (well it is but youll see what I mean) because I can keep walking, and use her lead to make sure she doesnt get close enough to actually bite and the other owner can make sure their dog doesnt get close enough to "retaliate". This may not make sense yet.

    A few weeks ago, Pippi and I were out for a walk. There was a guy sitting on a fence with an off lead dog by his feet. It was probably at least twice the size of Pippi. I saw the dog, so crossed the road so that Pippi didnt notice it and get agro. That worked well. We then had to cross back over because we lived on the same side as the dog. When we crossed back over, Pippi saw the other dog and carried on walking. No reaction.

    However, the other dog didnt ignore her. He charged us. The owner was yelling at him to stop but the dog wouldnt. Pippi started going nuts and right before the other dog got to us, I whipped Pippi up off the ground. Meantime the man is yelling "my dog is OK, hes friendly". I said to him "well mines not obviously".

    Now, whipping her up wasnt the right thing to do at all. I knwo that. However, Pippi would have attacked the other dog and then the other dog would have reacted with some self defence (and rightly so). The other dog was twice Pippis size so who is going to come out worse off in a scuffle? Hence I picked her up.

    If all dogs are on lead, she doesnt get picked up but because that dog was not unde control by its owner, I had no choice unless I wanted to let Pippi start something and then get her ass handed to her on a platter

  3. #93
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    May 2011
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    Gold Coast, Queensland
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    Default Where did I ever make the statement that my dog attacked another whilst on lead? ever

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyacinth View Post
    You started it. Personally I don't blame the breed for bad behaviour.


    No. I'm talking about using a rope or choke collar to strangle the dog, but like I said - not easy to do and grabbing the hind legs - maybe one person per leg - is easier and safer.


    very very unlikely. More likely people responsible did not recognise the signs.


    My guess at trying to understand this phrase: You think I should do some research on why dogs turn for no reason. Ie no reason that a human notices or understands.

    The only reason a dog turns "for no reason" is when it has a brain tumor. There are a squillion actual reasons why a dog turns and attacks another dog or human, almost all of them have warning signs in advance. A possible exception might be when the attacking dog has been trained by an extremely stupid human not to give any warning before it attacks. Ie any time it has expressed any fear or anxiety or upset about something - ie growled, it has been scolded and / or beaten for doing so.


    Your dog while on lead attacking another dog - does apply to you! Fair enough your dog was provoked and had a legal right in most states to defend itself (and you) but it certainly wasn't "under control" unless you gave it permission to attack or fight back.


    why? This is an open discussion forum. You're the one making rambling disconnected accusations and preposterous sentences. You're the one asking the rest of us to do "research" and back up what we say. Why don't you do the same?


    What is the relevance of this statement to this thread? Or even anything else you have written? I admire your support for AWL - I also support them - that's where my dog came from. But I have no idea why you added that comment in this thread.
    Perhaps now you will understand my frustration from the beginning. You have the opportunity to provide a quote demonstarting where I have said that Cheyanne ever on lead attacked another dog, Even in self defence..NEVER has this been stated but assumed from the beginning. She was attacked whilst she was on lead, never reacted, never....not ever...That in itself the fact that she has been judged for what you have just said seems to be the information that is completely assumed or made up or whatever, that is responsible for my frustration. Its annoying, it's like someone has decided Cheyanne was wrong, and she never showed wrong-Why would anyone keep promoting this same type of thinking. My dog does not deserve this untruth, nor judgement that she should behave, etc -she was a good girl, I claimed that it was wrong that she should have to put up with all that she did, considering she was on leash and did not attack any dog. I don't understand this thinking, sorry I just can't go along with this. In honour of her memory, I can't.
    Ho'neene'šeohtseva'e

  4. #94

    Default

    Mods, I suggest that this thread be closed as all the OP is doing now is twisting the words of others to continue an arguement.

    Please, for the sake of our computers, close this thread!!!

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dakota_Chey View Post
    Perhaps now you will understand my frustration from the beginning. You have the opportunity to provide a quote demonstarting where I have said that Cheyanne ever on lead attacked another dog, Even in self defence..NEVER has this been stated but assumed from the beginning. She was attacked whilst she was on lead, never reacted, never....not ever...That in itself the fact that she has been judged for what you have just said seems to be the information that is completely assumed or made up or whatever, that is responsible for my frustration. Its annoying, it's like someone has decided Cheyanne was wrong, and she never showed wrong-Why would anyone keep promoting this same type of thinking. My dog does not deserve this untruth, nor judgement that she should behave, etc -she was a good girl, I claimed that it was wrong that she should have to put up with all that she did, considering she was on leash and did not attack any dog. I don't understand this thinking, sorry I just can't go along with this. In honour of her memory, I can't.
    [/QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by bernie View Post
    I think responsibility is perhaps being avoided here.
    If your dog is not under your control when approached in ANY manner by an offleash dog, then you need to repeat your training.

    Note:
    You are powerless to control the behaviour of others, you are better off
    investing energy in taking the control that is available, ie. you and your dog's behaviour.

    With training, you can shape any dog to behave under your control. He may never "like" doggy friends. But he should bloody well behave.
    [/QUOTE]
    #7 (permalink) 05-07-2011, 12:52 AM
    Dakota_Chey
    Member Join Date: May 2011
    Location: Gold Coast, Queensland
    Posts: 30
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    Introduction and issues with dogs off leash

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836.../DakotaChey02#


    https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836...4421/Cheyanne# links of Cheyanne and DakotaHI all, We are new to this forum, Dakota and I. Totally understand the frustration as did our big beautiful longcoat g.shepherd that very recently passed away. When we walked her, we came across all kinds of ignorance and it affected her mostly directly as being such a big girl, we knew the blame would always be with her if she reacted at the many off leash dogs that would instantly become aggressive because they seemed intimidated by her size. She received quite a few nips to her underchin area by little nippy dogs and one attack to her muzzle by a labrador. Cheyanne whom was very soft and dog social, went from a well mannered girl to then raising her fur along her back when these dogs off their lead would tear up to her full of aggro. All in all, she got apprehensive, we got apprehensive and Cheyanne suffered then from crying to the point of our embarrassment, lol-because basically she had always been a very social girl with both people and other dogs and could not understand why we just could not take the risk of even meet and greets, in case she was bitten-therefore she would cry in desperation to socialise, I suppose wondering why she was not allowed to any longer. Had people controlled their dogs on leashes, nothing would have had to change. Without being biased, I saw something interesting on the tv. Little dogs seem to be trusted to run here and there by their owners and when a large dog approaches, owners tend to run toward their barking little friends and scoop them up, holding them up high as if they are going to be attacked. The dog trainer said that from a psychological perpective in doggie psych. that it automatically tells the dog that is standing on leash, that the higher dog is superior to it in ranking and causes confusion and tension between the two. I think that we have a wealth of knowledge to learn from our furry friends and forums such as these are a valuable resource for all interested dog owners. We have a new german shepherd longcoat big boned puppy, Dakota Chey (second name in memory of Cheyanne) and life without Cheyanne inspired us in our purchase and love of Dakota because we knew that life could not be the same without our German Shepherd as a valuable member in our family. No doubt the same trials and tribulations will arise with Dakota, however dogs are not and should not be expected to be saints and one would think that there should be a common respect for each and all of our dogs by keeping them on a leash always unless one decides to take their furry friend and the risk to leashfree dog parks.https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836...4421/Cheyanne#
    Ho'neene'šeohtseva'e

  6. #96
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    Dakota_Chey;

    Most of your posts I have to read two, three and four times to understand. I find your style of language incredibly difficult to follow. Many times, after four re-reads, I give up because I can't understand the point you are making.

    I suspect this is why it seems we disagree with you- because I don't think I am the only one who can't follow your posts. This is also most probably why there have been misunderstandings.

    Please, could you write more simply? Short sentences containing just the one idea. Gaps between paragraphs. I know I don't need to explain grammatical construct to you... Right?

    Just keep it simple?

  7. #97
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    Lightbulb The best reply I can give, see also bold text under this reply

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gold-dog
    Oh how I hate the people who have their dogs offlead if they can't control them. I was walking my girl this morning when a man, with a baby in a pram approached - he had his dog off lead. It rushed towards my girl, hackles up and started barking. Not bowed down as if it wanted to play. It was a much larger dog than mine. He called it, but it didn't respond. He said "it won't hurt your dog". There's no way that I could pick up my 20kg dog, even if I wanted to. I got my dog to sit, hoping that it would be a non threatening position to the other dog. I told her to "ignore". and she trusted me enough to do that. Why do people do that?

    #7 (permalink) 05-07-2011, 12:52 AM
    Dakota_Chey
    Member Join Date: May 2011
    Location: Gold Coast, Queensland
    Posts: 30
    Thanks: 10
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post


    Introduction and issues with dogs off leash

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836.../DakotaChey02#



    Quote:
    https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836...4421/Cheyanne# links of Cheyanne and DakotaHI all, We are new to this forum, Dakota and I. Totally understand the frustration as did our big beautiful longcoat g.shepherd that very recently passed away. When we walked her, we came across all kinds of ignorance and it affected her mostly directly as being such a big girl, we knew the blame would always be with her if she reacted at the many off leash dogs that would instantly become aggressive because they seemed intimidated by her size. She received quite a few nips to her underchin area by little nippy dogs and one attack to her muzzle by a labrador. Cheyanne whom was very soft and dog social, went from a well mannered girl to then raising her fur along her back when these dogs off their lead would tear up to her full of aggro. All in all, she got apprehensive, we got apprehensive and Cheyanne suffered then from crying to the point of our embarrassment, lol-because basically she had always been a very social girl with both people and other dogs and could not understand why we just could not take the risk of even meet and greets, in case she was bitten-therefore she would cry in desperation to socialise, I suppose wondering why she was not allowed to any longer. Had people controlled their dogs on leashes, nothing would have had to change. Without being biased, I saw something interesting on the tv. Little dogs seem to be trusted to run here and there by their owners and when a large dog approaches, owners tend to run toward their barking little friends and scoop them up, holding them up high as if they are going to be attacked. The dog trainer said that from a psychological perpective in doggie psych. that it automatically tells the dog that is standing on leash, that the higher dog is superior to it in ranking and causes confusion and tension between the two. I think that we have a wealth of knowledge to learn from our furry friends and forums such as these are a valuable resource for all interested dog owners. We have a new german shepherd longcoat big boned puppy, Dakota Chey (second name in memory of Cheyanne) and life without Cheyanne inspired us in our purchase and love of Dakota because we knew that life could not be the same without our German Shepherd as a valuable member in our family. No doubt the same trials and tribulations will arise with Dakota, however dogs are not and should not be expected to be saints and one would think that there should be a common respect for each and all of our dogs by keeping them on a leash always unless one decides to take their furry friend and the risk to leashfree dog parks.https://picasaweb.google.com/1003836...4421/Cheyanne#

    I was supporting the top quote as my first post in this forum, I was for her and her problem, because my dog should not have had to suffer because she was doing the right thing. Yeah it happens, but it should not happen, and I gave my reasons why. How better could Cheyanne have behaved, when even receiving bites to her face, never, ever in her history with us, reacted. The most was described where her fur would raise when other off leash dogs anywhere tore up to her. The reason she would cry is because she actually was very social, people, dogs and cats, our cat, my mothers cat, my mothers daschund, a house full of rex cats and all different size dogs (our friends) etc, etc-because she was on a lead, and held back from meeting-she cried. One of the incidents with a poodle was when we on lead walked through a u shape pathway, where the poodle was off lead and she was on lead, it looked nice and as we passed it left its owner went toward her in a split second with its yapping and literally jumped up and nipped her chin causing blood. The man looked at us like she had done something for being such a big girl. I find it kooky. Thats is why I made the statement, that we found that alot of dogs seemed intimidated of her size perhaps, big fluffy coat, whatever, that makes them act the way they did. these things cannot be predicted when they are dogs not on leads, unlike Cheyanne who always was.
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  8. #98
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    Default Will keep it short. simple. concise.

    The bold printed quote of mine. Two down from this reply. Makes my point. I do not think it is hard to see that Cheyanne has not attacked anything.
    Ho'neene'šeohtseva'e

  9. #99
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    Dakota_Chey;

    I have two Dobermanns. My boy is a bleeder- a canine hemophiliac. His blood does not clot. A cut can be life threatening.

    When he was neutered, I had to keep his blood pressure low. That meant keeping his arousal level low. That meant full time crating with slow, boring walks at 4 hourly intervals. On one if those walks, we encountered a small Bichon running off leash. Before I could turn and retreat, the bloody little bugger had latched on to my boy's nose. I grabbed it, prised it off and all but threw it back towards it's owners. I turn threatened to let Villain off his leash ( an empty threat with my boy, sadly) the people reacted by scooping their dog up and started cooing at it how bad a dog it was.

    So I hear you.

    But, on the other hand, it us my responsibility as my dogs' leader to always be looking out, planning and protecting. On that day I failed my dog because I did not do my duty as his leader.

    My other dog, on the other hand, would have ripped the little dog to bits.

    And in that case, too, I would have failed in my leadership by not teaching my dog to trust me to deal with the problem. To be able to simply hold her ground and allow her leader to lead. She needs training, I need to train her.

    The issue is not as simple as your poll suggests. I agree all dogs should be on lead in public, with few exceptions. This is not reality though. So our obligation as owners is to train our dogs to deal with such situations, and for us to be effective leaders.

    And sometimes, crap happens.

  10. #100
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    Your dog while on lead attacking another dog - does apply to you! Fair enough your dog was provoked and had a legal right in most states to defend itself (and you) but it certainly wasn't "under control" unless you gave it permission to attack or fight back.
    why? This is an open discussion forum.
    You're the one making rambling disconnected accusations and preposterous sentences
    Ho'neene'šeohtseva'e

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