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Thread: Who's responsable?

  1. #1
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    Default Who's responsable?

    I was in a discussion with a colleague, who was relaying her last dog walk scenario. Her dog has had 2 surgeries to first repair, then amputate her back leg. It has now got the all clear for off leash play/romps/free to be a dog!
    The dog is a min pin x JRT, he's 7 months old, lives in a flat no garden, with 2 adults.
    Walked plenty, but on leash only so far in its life, due to having early surgery that went wrong despite rehab.
    So its off leash for first time. With other dogs. Playing chaser/chased role. And then my colleague decided, because 'she knew' that the dog was tired, asked the owner of the dog to recall his dogs, as they were not stopping so she could catch her small dog, and is now worried its actually too rough exercise. The man said they were fine, just playing and would not harm her dog. That he would not recall the dogs annoyed my colleague. I asked why she did not recall hers? And she explained this is her dogs 1st time off leash, and he doesnt have a recall. This is at a offleash dog lake area.

    I suggested that the entire scenario was 50 shades of screwed anyhow, poor planning n all that jazz. She's now furious with me, that i do not agree that the man with the dogs was responsible in entirety, and should her dog of been injured, she would legislate against the owner.

    I left it with, hey ho, lets agree to differ then.
    I believe that if you have no recall, then the dog should be on a line tether of some sort to keep control.
    I believe that if you dont know how your dog reacts around other dogs, you have a responsibility to keep it on a leash/under control, its the law.
    I believe that you get in there, and grab your dog smartish, at the first sign of concern when others are nearby. Not expect others to do this for you.
    Last edited by bernie; 12-28-2013 at 08:41 AM.

  2. #2
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    If something were to happen she is definitely responsible. Letting your dog off leash with no recall what so ever? tsk tsk tsk.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  3. #3
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    If her dog didn't have recall then she can't really complain. But it was quite unkind of the other dog owner to not help, I think. I've had situations where our foster pup started following other people/dogs at the off leash area and they didn't bother to stop to let me catch up to grab the pup. Yes, totally my fault because the pup's recall is not up to scratch yet and I would never accuse them of doing anything wrong. But not very sympathetic. Especially the woman who kept squealing at Dana in a really high pitched voice the other day while she and her playful dog walked further and further away from me. Until Banjo got fed up and went to retrieve her.

    So there's being right and being kind and showing solidarity with other dog owners with dogs in training.

  4. #4
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    It does help to yell at the other dog owner that yours is recovering from injury / surgery and play time has to be limited. There's usually some way of wording it that works.

    But the rules of every off lead dog space I know of, including the fully fenced is - your dog must come when called ie "effective control" the same kind of control you have as if the dog is on lead. So you need to be able to call your dog away from playing with other dogs, from children, from people having a picnic on the ground inside the dog off lead area. All those things.

    Which you can't expect of a dog first time off lead with zero recall training.

    Recall training - starts inside the flat. Saying the dog's name, your recall word and pairing that with yummy treats. And then gradually increasing the distractions... and using a long line outside so you still have control. Doing recalls outside where there are no distractions, or there are other dogs far away...

    You also practice lots of "collar grab" ie grab dogs collar and give treat. Build up to grabbing the dog's collar suddenly and roughly - and giving a treat. Ie the kind of fast surprise grab you do when you're in a panic about the dog getting hurt.

    If you can't control the situation - don't let your dog off into it.

  5. #5
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    Who is responsible for the welfare of the min pin x? The owner. It should not be let off lead unless it has a good recall.

    Who is at fault if the small dog is injured by the other larger dogs due to a fight? The owner of the other dogs, as that owner should also have verbal control over the dogs and be able to call the dogs away from the fight.

    It is a matter of courtesy to call back your dog if aanother dog owner asks you to. If you can't do that then they shouldn't be off lead.

    I agree that saying your dog is recovering from surgery helps the other owner understand but you will always have a dog owner that doesn't give a rats and it's your job to keep your dog safe. Read body language and detect early warnings of problem behaviours... and sort out the recall.

  6. #6
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    I just find it strange that someone would refuse to call their dogs when asked to. I can't think of any reason myself for refusing a request like that.

  7. #7
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    Maybe his dogs don't have a recall either

  8. #8
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    Also, even a dog with impeccable recall would struggle to obey if 2 dogs are trying to play with him. I can call Banjo away from other dogs without any issues, but I've been in situations when another dog or dogs wouldn't stop jumping all over her when I called her and the only way she could have come to me was by using physical violence. It should be my decision when I want to remove my dog from a situation like that and I expect other dog owners to cooperate by calling their dogs off.

    If they were kids we'd find that normal and tell them 'Little Susie has to go now so stop shooting your water pistol at her'.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Pawfectionist View Post
    Who is at fault if the small dog is injured by the other larger dogs due to a fight? The owner of the other dogs, as that owner should also have verbal control over the dogs and be able to call the dogs away from the fight.
    I think this depends. I was walking my cattle dog and she was repeatedly mobbed by a couple of Jack russells. They were not under control and were biting at her legs and barking. She is a very non confrontational dog and tried to hide behind my legs. These beasts were like machines. Eventually she started to growl as I was doing my best to fend them off her but failing. I ended up walking into the ocean with her to escape the little bastards and the possibility that her avoidance of attacking them would end. Whose fault would it have been if she had attacked them trying to defend herself? As it is she came away with blood on her legs from their bites. I bet the owner would have blamed the bigger dog.
    Last edited by Kalacreek; 12-30-2013 at 11:02 AM.

  10. #10
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    Kalacreek, I was referring to the situation given. If they were playing and then a fight broke out is very different to dogs coming up and attacking a dog for no reason and having the dog retaliate to defend itself.

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