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Thread: Cultures effect on dogs.

  1. #1
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    Default Cultures effect on dogs.

    Ive noticed in an american forum, that there is a completely different attitude to dogs. Almost like its your 'constitutional right', to own a guard breed, much like a gun.

    so i ignore that they chop bits off their dogs still, as humans think dogs should have guinea pig ears and no tails. As time will deal with this, maybe?

    But reading a thread about a woman, who rehomes a english mastiff as the family want a 2nd dog to play with their lab. they get there, the 14month old pup is on a prong collar, in the home. It bites one of its owners in front of visiting potential adopters. Who proceed to accept this dangerous pup right now, into their family, pop's it in back of car with 7yr old kid. Who gets bitten by dog on way home.

    I mentioned the prong collar, inside the home was a red flag. And nobody else thought this abnormal, or a concern. That they want guard dogs, and the price is bite risk.

    the world dog attacks include american family dogs. Surely, this culture has to be scewing the statistics a LOT. Its like another world exists, that is sooooo dangerous, that you need a high risk of mutilation to your kids dog to just survive there. Ive only been on holiday, and seriously, its didnt seem to justify such risks.

    WTF?

  2. #2

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    Hi Bernie,
    Having been to America it was hard not to notice gun culture going on there,legal & illegal. I would imagine in that situation that people believe that having a dangerous dog like this may stop them from having to shoot someone breaking into there home one day, its a radical approach to a bad situation where the dog is used as a safety tool and not a loving pet...Makes you think about how scared people have become in that environment...very sad.

  3. #3
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    "not a loving pet"
    I think i am an foreigner then. As my mind does not think along these lines. I understand working vs pet dog. Perhaps its a further extension of this. Its basically a gun on four legs. a protection dog without the training, relationship rules, boundaries or safety equipment.

  4. #4

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    I recently spent some time in the States myself; where I was staying in New Hampshire the number plates read, 'Live free or die.' There certainly seems to be a bit of scare mongering going on, but let's say you do need a gun and a guard dog for the sake of the argument, even under those circumstances, how does that justify owning an animal that bites non-threatening targets? They don't even know how it will react to threatening targets...

    What use is a guard dog that you can't take anywhere because it bites indiscriminately? In my eyes, the best guard dog is one you could have anywhere with you, because you don't know when you'll need help. Breeding stupid, reactive, thin nerved animals is not helping anyone. And then if you have a dog with the right blocks, you then need to train it and socialise it so it learns to read you and identify threats. And then you need to work with the dog in that space so that firstly, you know your dog and secondly so that you can override your dog's response if need be and the dog learns to think whilst 'in the zone.'

    There's only one problem with all that though. I now have a dog that I can take anywhere, around anything and not have to worry about him doing the wrong thing. He has also shown me now that he will protect me whether it's from 2 men who were later convicted of murder and rape, or over-enthusiastic ex's who won't take no for an answer (people he has a strong relationship with). And he doesn't go overboard. But I have spent so much time with him, training him and just having him with me that now I can't bear the thought of anything happening to him and my urge to protect him is almost on par with my urge to protect myself.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by bernie View Post
    "not a loving pet"
    I think i am an foreigner then. As my mind does not think along these lines. I understand working vs pet dog. Perhaps its a further extension of this. Its basically a gun on four legs. a protection dog without the training, relationship rules, boundaries or safety equipment.
    From what I've seen of 'working lines,' some are bred deliberately to be thin nerved so they react and put on a big show for even the smallest stimulus. People think these dogs will be more protective and they sell well, but in my eyes, these are very dangerous dogs. They are easily overwhelmed and when that happens, you just don't know what they'll do. You certainly can't control or trust them.

    I feel that with Sammy, he's an extremely effective deterrent. I don't believe that I will ever be the victim of a random attack, because why would you choose the person with the Dobe/Rottie cross over the person next door? I hope he never has to physically defend me; fortunately to date I've found that if he positions himself between me and the threatening person/people and growls and shows teeth, they tend to back off pretty quickly. But you don't need a dog that bites your children to achieve this. I think there are 2 different reasons you'll be attacked - 1 is that there are people who will steal from, rape or even attack random people. I believe that a dog (particularly a big one) protects you almost completely from this type of risk, people seem to have an inherent fear of strange dogs. 2 is that it's from someone you know, who wants to hurt you in particular. Well in that case, a dog is easily dispatched. So really what do you stand to gain from having an animal that dangerous? If anything, you're just introducing an additional risk to your family...

  6. #6
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    It's very interesting. Because there is also a trend that is more popular in the US than anywhere else to be very risk aversive, especially when it comes to kids but also pets. Must be in the big cities more. Because then you hear the stories on the news about small kids being given guns to "practice" with. And if one accidentally shoots himself or his baby brother, that's just the risk you need to take to be prepared for the incredibly small chance that you will ever need that gun to protect your own life. While in other places in the US young kids are getting suspended from school for biting a gun shape out of their biscuit at lunchtime (not kidding, true story). A very DID society, it seems!

    I also remember a discussion on another forum about silly criteria some US dog rescue organisation had for allowing a dog to be adopted by someone. Stuff like "You must supervise your dog in your yard at all times". I think they even mentioned it was because the bats could attack him or something. But from the responses it became clear that lots of people didn't even have any kind of fence around their properties and thought it was totally ok to let their dogs roam.

    One thing that annoys me about how Australian culture can affect how dogs are treated is the "farm dog" mentality by people in suburbia. I've had rants about it before. I grew up in Belgium where it is extremely rare for dogs to live outside. They even get taken to shops and restaurants. And on public transport. So better socialisation is achieved more often because they get exposed to all those stimuli from an early age. On the other hand, they often don't even have a yard to run around in and get locked up inside a lot too.

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    I am glad I live in Australia.

  8. #8
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    The dumbest thing about the yanks and their "Freedom" is that they gave it all up when they elected Bush the second time and he introduced the Patriot act - which means they (and we since Howard brought in the same) have no right to privacy or freedom.

    They can arrest anyone they like and lock them up indefinitely with no right to a lawyer or a trial or any kind of accountability because anyone could be a terrorist. And that's one of the things we thought was bad about all the previous world dictators and totalitarian governments.

    And they put whistle blowers in prison and threaten them with the death penalty for treason.

    Guard dogs (and small firearms) are no protection against the USA government but that's what the original "right to carry arms" was about. So they couldn't be oppressed or over taxed the way the English Government did a couple of hundred years ago.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyacinth View Post
    The dumbest thing about the yanks and their "Freedom" is that they gave it all up when they elected Bush the second time and he introduced the Patriot act - which means they (and we since Howard brought in the same) have no right to privacy or freedom.

    They can arrest anyone they like and lock them up indefinitely with no right to a lawyer or a trial or any kind of accountability because anyone could be a terrorist. And that's one of the things we thought was bad about all the previous world dictators and totalitarian governments.

    And they put whistle blowers in prison and threaten them with the death penalty for treason.

    Guard dogs (and small firearms) are no protection against the USA government but that's what the original "right to carry arms" was about. So they couldn't be oppressed or over taxed the way the English Government did a couple of hundred years ago.
    No escaping it now

  10. #10
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    we could vote green or move to NZ...

    Feel sorry and outraged for Julian Assange though.

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