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Thread: Teaching how to drop

  1. #11
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    I imagine you could get the same effect with a flat collar and just yanking that down. But what you're doing seems like a version of "escape training" ie to escape the discomfort of the chain collar - a drop works (ie discomfort is removed/escaped by doing the drop) so dog learns ie you're rewarding by removing an adversive/unpleasantness for the dog when they do what they want.

    Personally - I'd rather give the dog something it enjoys for doing what I want.

  2. #12
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    Dog is always rewarded with praise/treats when check chain is in use - dog wanders from side, check dog back in, reward with a praise. My dog gets off on lots of voice praise, more so than using treats and most importantly the chain works for US

    Personally i love it & i've never looked back since, chain has become an essential in my household.

  3. #13
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    Dog is always rewarded with praise/treats when check chain is in use - dog wanders from side, check dog back in, reward with a praise. My dog gets off on lots of voice praise, more so than using treats so she isn't missing out, she gets what she wants in return for something i want. The chain works for US

    Personally i love it & i've never looked back since, chain has become an essential in my household.

  4. #14
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    @Kuri- just be careful that you don't accidentally pair a check with a reward, otherwise you will get a dog who will absolutely put up with a check in order to get to the reward. I'm not criticizing you, just keep a really close watch on your timing because if that's off, you could end up with unanticipated consequences.

    I do use slight pressure in a downwards direction on a flat collar combined with guiding hands to teach a drop. But I only use a check chain after I know fully that the dog understands the mechanics and command- as well as the release. When I am teaching a skill, it is important for it to be error and correction free for the learning dog.

  5. #15
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    Check chains are no good for me and my dog. I've trained others with check / choke chains no problems and I can't believe how rough I used to be. But my current dog - just goes to pieces if there is any kind of adversive involved. She can handle verbal interruptions like "what are you doing" and "pssttt" and "oops" (you're not going to get a treat for that). But she even shuts down or gets frustrated and stressed if I stuff up and show any kind of disappointment in what is happening. So I really don't need to be "correcting" her with a check chain or pulling her around with it. And my timing generally sucks with that anyway. So it's not for us.

    I've also met a few people whose dogs were permanently damaged physically or psychologically - from the use of check chains - so they're not for every one either.

    And I have to say - the chains being used out at the park - I've yet to see a single one being used correctly. Ie check and release. The dogs are either not even on lead - which leaves a playful dog vulnerable to other dogs connecting with the chain, or getting tangled in feet or teeth, or they're on lead and the chain is the wrong way round and/or the dog's out in front and pulling like there is no choke chain on - and the chain is always tight and never released.

  6. #16
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    I only use a check chain whilst we are practicing at home or whilst we are at obedience. My obedience club is very strict with timing and the correct use of the chain, so it's fair to say i know what i'm doing. We have professional trainers that will pull us up on anything we are doing wrong and show us a way of correction. We are taught from the beginning that whenever the chain is checked, to reward the correct position with lots of praise (pats, good girl etc) and then as they advance shorten the praise (quick well done & continue on). We are now at the stage where she does obedience classes off-lead so there is barely any need for the chain.

    Chain goes on she knows its 'time for school', quick high five after training she knows she's finished & the harness means general everyday walkies (can sniff about, etc). Before i enrolled her at our local club i was well against check chains as i thought they were cruel. A year later after being taught how to use one properly and seeing the results i see now (and i do realise they don't work for everybody) i am a great advocate for using them and will sing their praise whenever i can.

    I don't see any detrimental affect with her in using one, i couldn't be any happier in regards to her training (i'm an overly proud mummy) and it's awesome to see her know her routine and watch her smile from ear to ear after each session because i always let her know how proud she has done me (even when i know it's far from her best) because that's all it really comes down to.
    Last edited by Kuri_89; 04-27-2012 at 09:59 PM.

  7. #17

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    i taught Jack sit, stay, and shake hands using the "nice" treat techniques, however the only way i could get him to drop was pushing him to the ground. Didn't take many goes before he got the idea but none of the "nice" methods worked so that was what i resorted to. While its not ideal, its not causing pain or fear so i don't see any problem with using that technique as a last resort

  8. #18
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    Thanks guys Great Tips!

    As I meantioned I did attempt the collar thing but Maybe its because she is a Bulldog and they are stubborn as hell but there was No getting that pup down and she is strong as hell. She has a choker but I very much guess that it would be the same effect. I also don't like to do too much man handling of her, She only resists when she really doesn't want to do something so I NEVER force her.

    Funny because I always say, my kids don't get to chose when and where they want to listen to me but Ruby does LMAO Sad sad sad

    So Going to give these extra tips a go Now
    Rubylisious


  9. #19
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    Just another add sadly I am yet to use the word drop.. As I have read that you should say the word until they complete the action, hope Im not wrong haha
    Rubylisious


  10. #20
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    "When Pigs Fly - Training Success with Impossible Dogs" - by Jane Killion
    at Dogwise.com


    you might want to have a read of this book "When Pigs Fly - Training Success with Impossible Dogs" - by Jane Killon

    One of my friends owns an extremely well behaved bull terrier - though her drops get a bit random - in the obedience ring. It's different if the boss's fingers happen to smell like blue vein cheese (apparently washing does not get that smell off).

    I'm also reading "control unleashed" by Lesley McDevitt which I borrowed from the same friend and now I want my own copy. It's written from the agility point of view by a trainer who ended up doing remedial classes with all the spechull dogs who would nick off, go sniff, or get nasty around other dogs (note those ones had to start on their own).

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