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Thread: Advanced Obediance Training??

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Sunshine Coast


    I don't know about dogs reducing birdlife, what about cat owners? Cats would do a lot more danger to the wildlife. I've never seen a dog be too successful at catching a bird.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2009


    Osckar's mum

    They've already banned cat ownership on Lord Howe Island
    Lord Howe Island - A Remote Island Paradise

    So the only ones left would be feral and fair game for the rangers.

  3. #13

    Default Thanks!

    Thanks for your explanation of CD and CCD's....I'm sure they don't know what the Advanced Obedience Training is, because they wont tell me what my dog has to do to pass and achieve the certificate. I've sent two emails to them asking about it and all they've done is request the contact number of someone on the Forum, so they can talk to them about it..???
    Nothing happens to fast over here, but my (Eddies) time is running out. I'll be going down there to confront them next week about their lack of urgency, if they don't contact me today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyacinth View Post
    CD and CCD are competition obedience titles (grades). Community companion dog aka CCD is on lead (except for the recall) and Novice aka Companion dog/CD is off lead - CCD is "beginners" and CD is the next level up. So you have to compete to get these titles. I imagine on Lord Howe - there wouldn't be much dog obedience competition. And the titles go to the dog not the trainer/human.

    And like Newfsie said - some of these dogs that do well in the competition ring are complete rogues out of it - though that has more to do with how consistent the trainer is in and out of the ring - ie they only demand a high standard of their dog at club and club training and club competition but let them do what they like down the park or at home - not the best way to manage a dog but lots of people do it.

    All the rules for different kinds of ANKC competitions and titles are here.
    Australian National Kennel Council

    The obedience rules (pdf) includes all the criteria for all the levels of competition - you could give that to your ranger.

    It does seem like your ranger has no idea what the "advanced obedience certificate" is. If he thinks an obedience title qualifies.

    Criteria for CD (novice class) - include

    Heel Free (heel off lead)
    Stand Free for Examination. (dog has to hold a stand politely with owner standing in front while judge approaches and gives it a pat)
    Retrieve on the Flat (dog goes and gets a stylised wooden dumbell that you have thrown in front of it)
    Change of Position eg you ask your dog to "stand" and stay and then from a distance you ask your dog to "sit".
    1 Min Sit Stay.
    3 Min Down Stay

    Notice how none of these require a dog to ignore a bird down the beach. Although it does get very interesting when flocks of magpies decide to stalk through the sit-stays or possums run across in front of dogs doing "down stays" or just for fun - one dog gets up and goes and attacks or sits on another dog.

    It's a much higher standard than most family pets are required, but it is a formal competition thing, not a all day every day kind of thing, and dogs are really good at figuring out the context and differences. Like the difference between how you would behave at your friend's wedding and how you behave with him down the pub.

    The ranger needs to be able to decide what they need dogs on the island to be able to do - and then test them, ie go down the beach or park where there are not too many endangered birds, and make sure
    1. your dog can walk past them (on lead) and ignore them.
    2. you can call your dog to you and he ignores the birds
    3. that if you're not paying attention to your dog (eg you're talking to the ranger), he still ignores the island wildlife.
    I sometimes practice this with Frosty and her dinner, can I call her past her dinner to me - and then give her permission to eat her dinner.

    If there are very few dogs on the island it should be easy to do this kind of test for each dog. If there are dogs that live together - loose in their yards - they should be tested together - because one dog alone might not chase the birds, but two together can act differently.

    And I still think your local political rep and Steve Courtney would be good people to talk to about this.

    The island management want to keep the fauna (and flora?) safe from dogs - so work out how to test that (and that's where Steve could help). You could start the test with a chicken or duck in a cage - instead of using the local endangered wild life. If the dog can ignore the chicken - then it might be safe to test out in the open...

  4. #14


    No cats allowed on the island....the last one died about 15 years ago.
    The gound birds are very tame. If Eddy stays still they'll walk right up to him.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2009



    It seems nuts to me that they should expect you to comply with some standard they have no definition for, ie they cannot tell you what it is. To me that seems wrong/illegal. It also seems wrong that they're asking you to comply with some standard they provide no means of achieving. Though that's not all that different to them expecting doctors to be qualifed and not providing a teaching hospital.

    I reckon if you talked to Steve Courtney via email if that's easier, and put up on youtube some video of your dog passing a test like the one I described - devised between you and Steve where your dog ignores the wildlife - then Steve would write you a "certificate of obedience" for your dog. He's a qualified dog trainer. And he'd be sympathetic to your cause. And your island administration would not be able to argue it's "invalid" because they can't tell you what "valid" is.

    K9 Pro The K9 Professionals; Online Dog Shop
    email is

  6. #16


    THis is another of those situations where an idiot behind a desk needs to justify his position so comes up with a crap piece of legislation that just won't do what he says it will do, and I bet he has never even beem to LHI. Typical civil servant bs. Like banning breeds.
    As everyone has said above, obedience training to most levels will not guarantee that the dog will not chase a bird.
    I, however, do believe that every dog owner should do some sort of obedience training just so that they have a better understanding and relationship with their pet, but that is something that I do not think you can legislate for.
    It would be simpler and far more effective for them to legislate that every dog must be on lead when it is not on its own property. If a dog escapes a back yard, the owner should face some sort of penalty, maybe a day in the stocks, and if it happens again the dog is sent off the island.
    If all dogs are microchipped, it would be a piece of cake to find the owner if one does stray.
    I reckon that that would make any dog owner absolutely certain their yards were 100pc safe and secure, that their leads and collars were in order, and that the dogs had been trained to walk politely on lead.
    Nev Allen
    Border River Pet Resort

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2009


    I think the LHI admin is actually on LHI, but they're a bit like the local council, often clueless. I think they just want to get rid of dogs, and are too evasive to say so.

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