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Thread: how to stop my dog barking in the car & going crazy

  1. #1
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    Default how to stop my dog barking in the car & going crazy

    hi my rescue dog Tyler has a big issue which i have no clue if can be fixed. he seems to love going into my car as he tries to jump in all the time and runs away after awhile at the dog beach when he realizes that is the path back to the car. weird. anyways once in the car and driving he non stops barks, drools and jumps around.

    i have him in a big crate in the back seat of a sedan car which is not that practical for me. i have been told that when he sat in a harness in a volunteers car he ended up chewing her car and seat belt.

    I don't think its necessarily moving objects he is barking at as he does it when we are stationary and it seems to be a game possible as he is ready to start barking and watching me for as soon as i close the car door to get in myself.

    things i have tried:
    - kong with food treats - paid no attention
    - his toys. he is obsessed with tennis balls - paid no attention
    - sheet over the crate - moved around so much it came off. perhaps i need to try a bigger one and a rug instead


    Some ideas i might look into is a thunder shirt and Bach Flower Remedies for Animals.


    Has anyone heard of the above being any effective and does anyone have any ideas of what might be causing his reaction to the car and how to fix?

    Thanks in advance
    Karlene

  2. #2
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    Tyler needs a dog trainer ASAP. Sounds like the car is just too exciting and self rewarding for him and hence he needs to be in it all the time. Thunder shirts and bach flower are for anxiety, your dog has gone past that point.

    If you dont want to get a trainer in you will need to counter condition him. So number one, he can't go into the car unless he's calm and quiet. Don't let him rush in, he's only allowed to go in when he's quiet, then sit straight on the seat. Then call him out again before he goes nuts. Do this a few times at random intervals and please don't say things like 'Come on!' or 'Let's Go!' or anything that razzes him up. Dogs are creatures of pattern and habit, you have to break the old habits to change the behavior. Gradually keep doing that and no leaving the driveway until the dog is calm. I would be having someone sit next to the dog while he's in the car too in order to distract and reward him for not being a lunatic. Reinforce behaviors like 'drop' and 'lay down' and keep rewarding for the dog doing it.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by karlene View Post
    hi my rescue dog Tyler has a big issue which i have no clue if can be fixed. he seems to love going into my car as he tries to jump in all the time and runs away after awhile at the dog beach when he realizes that is the path back to the car. weird. anyways once in the car and driving he non stops barks, drools and jumps around.

    i have him in a big crate in the back seat of a sedan car which is not that practical for me. i have been told that when he sat in a harness in a volunteers car he ended up chewing her car and seat belt.

    I don't think its necessarily moving objects he is barking at as he does it when we are stationary and it seems to be a game possible as he is ready to start barking and watching me for as soon as i close the car door to get in myself.

    things i have tried:
    - kong with food treats - paid no attention
    - his toys. he is obsessed with tennis balls - paid no attention
    - sheet over the crate - moved around so much it came off. perhaps i need to try a bigger one and a rug instead


    Some ideas i might look into is a thunder shirt and Bach Flower Remedies for Animals.


    Has anyone heard of the above being any effective and does anyone have any ideas of what might be causing his reaction to the car and how to fix?

    Thanks in advance
    Karlene
    Hi Karlene,

    Many (positive-only trainers) will disagree with my advise to you, but I do this for a living and have been doing it very successfully for the last 33 years with a success rate of higher than 99.5%.
    Simply put, your dog exhibits an unacceptable behavior that if not addressed correctly will most likely escalate to the point where it effects the safe operation of your motor vehicle.

    You have three basic options in relation to this unwanted behavior...... accept it, manage it or extinguish it. There fact that you have asked for help on this forum tells me that you are not willing just to accept the behavior and that's good. The two remaining options of either managing or extinguishing the behavior can both be achieved innumerable ways, some of them easier, more practical and efficient than others.

    Here is a brief overview of the two remaining options from my perspective;

    Management Options -
    1. Don't take the dog on the car anymore (very impractical)
    2. Physically inhibit the barking with a 'Husher' muzzle (may inhibit the dogs ability to regulate its temperature in a hot car)
    3. Wear ear muffs while you drive... sounds silly I know but one of my clients who drove from Toowoomba to the Brisbane Airport each day with her over-vocal German Shepherd had to do just that...... Un till I came along anyway

    A lot of the methods you have tried already are just distraction or redirection techniques...... while these may occasionally work to some degree, they really do not address the dogs desire to do the unwanted behavior... they just momentarily distract the dog from it.

    Extinguishing Options -
    1. Counter-conditioning routine. It's a long process that really needs professional guidance, if only to plan out the steps and identify the milestones/benchmarks that signal the transition to the next stage of the routine.
    2. Remote Training Collar - Outlawed in four of the less progressive states, but OK in the other four. Still requires professional guidance and instruction but if this is an option where you live then it will solve your dogs behavioral problem within an hour of first application. The most number of stimulations your dog will need to receive from the remote training collar in order to extinguish the unwanted barking is three.
    3. Standard behavior extinction routine - This involves the application of a standard aversive to the dog that is paired with the undesired behavior. Again if done properly the most number of aversives that your dog will need to receive to stop the barking is just three.

    People who are not familiar with my methods are often skeptical about my claim about requiring only three aversives in order to extinguish an unwanted behavior. I don't mind others skepticism, I don't let that interfere with or distract me from what I'm doing. What I do is not new, it's not magic, it's not voodoo and it's not a secret. It's just basic canine behavior theory without any bells, whistles or political correctness

    If you are going to go for the extinguishing option then you should seek out the services of a canine professional in your area. By way of clarification I am not referring to someone who is just a trainer at their local dog club, but a true canine professional.
    Regards,
    Grant 'The Paw Man'
    RAAF Police Dog Handler, 33 yrs service & Civilian Canine Behavior Specialist

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by karlene View Post
    hi my rescue dog Tyler has a big issue which i have no clue if can be fixed. he seems to love going into my car as he tries to jump in all the time and runs away after awhile at the dog beach when he realizes that is the path back to the car. weird. anyways once in the car and driving he non stops barks, drools and jumps around.

    i have him in a big crate in the back seat of a sedan car which is not that practical for me. i have been told that when he sat in a harness in a volunteers car he ended up chewing her car and seat belt.

    I don't think its necessarily moving objects he is barking at as he does it when we are stationary and it seems to be a game possible as he is ready to start barking and watching me for as soon as i close the car door to get in myself.

    things i have tried:
    - kong with food treats - paid no attention
    - his toys. he is obsessed with tennis balls - paid no attention
    - sheet over the crate - moved around so much it came off. perhaps i need to try a bigger one and a rug instead


    Some ideas i might look into is a thunder shirt and Bach Flower Remedies for Animals.


    Has anyone heard of the above being any effective and does anyone have any ideas of what might be causing his reaction to the car and how to fix?

    Thanks in advance
    Karlene
    Hi Karlene,

    Many (positive-only trainers) will disagree with my advise to you, but I do this for a living and have been doing it very successfully for the last 33 years with a success rate of higher than 99.5%.
    Simply put, your dog exhibits an unacceptable behavior that if not addressed correctly will most likely escalate to the point where it effects the safe operation of your motor vehicle.

    You have three basic options in relation to this unwanted behavior...... accept it, manage it or extinguish it. There fact that you have asked for help on this forum tells me that you are not willing just to accept the behavior and that's good. The two remaining options of either managing or extinguishing the behavior can both be achieved innumerable ways, some of them easier, more practical and efficient than others.

    Here is a brief overview of the two remaining options from my perspective;

    Management Options -
    1. Don't take the dog on the car anymore (very impractical)
    2. Physically inhibit the barking with a 'Husher' muzzle (may inhibit the dogs ability to regulate its temperature in a hot car)
    3. Wear ear muffs while you drive... sounds silly I know but one of my clients who drove from Toowoomba to the Brisbane Airport each day with her over-vocal German Shepherd had to do just that...... Until I came along anyway

    A lot of the methods you have tried already are just distraction or redirection techniques...... while these may occasionally work to some degree, they really do not address the dogs desire to do the unwanted behavior... they just momentarily distract the dog from it.

    Extinguishing Options -
    1. Counter-conditioning routine. It's a long process that really needs professional guidance, if only to plan out the steps and identify the milestones/benchmarks that signal the transition to the next stage of the routine.
    2. Remote Training Collar - Outlawed in four of the less progressive states, but OK in the other four. Still requires professional guidance and instruction but if this is an option where you live then it will solve your dogs behavioral problem within an hour of first application. The most number of stimulations your dog will need to receive from the remote training collar in order to extinguish the unwanted barking is three.
    3. Standard behavior extinction routine - This involves the application of a standard aversive to the dog that is paired with the undesired behavior. Again if done properly the most number of aversives that your dog will need to receive to stop the barking is just three.

    People who are not familiar with my methods are often skeptical about my claim about requiring only three aversives in order to extinguish an unwanted behavior. I don't mind others skepticism, I don't let that interfere with or distract me from what I'm doing. What I do is not new, it's not magic, it's not voodoo and it's not a secret. It's just basic canine behavior theory without any bells, whistles or political correctness

    If you are going to go for the extinguishing option then you should seek out the services of a canine professional in your area. By way of clarification I am not referring to someone who is just a trainer at their local dog club, but a true canine professional.
    Regards,
    Grant 'The Paw Man'
    RAAF Police Dog Handler, 33 yrs service & Civilian Canine Behavior Specialist

  5. #5

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    Hi The Paw Man,

    can you expand a little on the "application of a standard aversive" to the dog please?

    My Jack started barking and carrying on as we got closer to the beach each day(just simple over excitement). This started happening during a period when my younger brother was coming with me most days(i beleive it was the added excitement of having another family member there that triggered the behaviour). I have pretty much extinguished the behaviour(not entrely though) by making Jack sit on the front seat next to me where he won't bark as he knows i don't like it and he can't get out of my reach. I'm certainly interested in hearing of other methods.

    c heers

  6. #6

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    sorry double post

  7. #7
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    Jan 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by mymatejack View Post
    Hi The Paw Man,

    can you expand a little on the "application of a standard aversive" to the dog please?

    My Jack started barking and carrying on as we got closer to the beach each day(just simple over excitement). This started happening during a period when my younger brother was coming with me most days(i beleive it was the added excitement of having another family member there that triggered the behaviour). I have pretty much extinguished the behaviour(not entrely though) by making Jack sit on the front seat next to me where he won't bark as he knows i don't like it and he can't get out of my reach. I'm certainly interested in hearing of other methods.

    c heers
    Hi 'MyMateJack'
    There are just as many variations within the applications of aversives as their are within the application of rewards, but let's look at one of the most common simple ones, an aversive delivered via a check chain.

    So the application of a standard aversive via a check chain to extinguish an undesired behavior would consist of the following;

    1. (Assuming the choke chain is fitted correctly) The trainer delivers the aversive by the rapid application pulling force on the leash attached to the choke chain. The duration of this pulling force should not exceed one second. Delivering constant force to a dog triggers Positive Thigmotaxis creating an undesirable (physical) opposition response.

    2. The amount of force applied is determined by the particular dogs Threshold Of Discomfort (TOD). Force applied below a dogs TOD is not perceived by the dog as a negative, so it may still temporarily halt the undesired behavior by virtue if its 'startle' effect or merely serve as a behavioral interrupter. Ideally an aversive should be delivered at the dogs TOD and not significantly above or below it. The most obvious indicator that you have reached a dogs TOD is a small yip or yelp from the dog.

    3. Aversives when applied correctly are non-injurious but they are not allowed to injure or physically harm the dog.

    4. Aversives are applied mechanically and not emotionally by the handler. The projection of anger or prolonged threatening body language from the handler toward the dog has the effect of stretching out the time frame of the aversive which must be less than one second in duration.

    5. An aversive is not a 'punishment' nor a judgement, rather it is just the negative consequence of the dogs actions.

    An aversive can be applied by the use of physical force or by the use of electrical force. Both of these types of force are non injurious when done correctly. I do not believe an aversive can be applied verbally and it cannot be applied by removing anything from the dog as in 'P-'

    Obviously there is more information the handler needs to know before delivering an aversive to their dog, but that should be enough information to answer your question
    Regards,
    Grant 'The Paw Man'
    RAAF Police Dog Handler, 33 yrs service & Civilian Canine Behavior Specialist

  8. #8

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    Hi the pawman, i used to read your ropics years ago on a defence forum. I still remeber the gsd and the crayon. Im glad you have found this forum.

  9. #9
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    Hi Karlene

    Not sure how a thundershirt or bach flower will help unless you think the dog is barking because he's frightened or anxious about something. Eg Thunder.

    I like Nekhbet's method. Pay attention to exactly when your dog starts barking - and do something different before that. Eg if it's when you get in the car, try opening the door and then closing it again. Or if he barks - get out and wait for him to stop and then get back in. Good to practice this when you don't need to go anywhere in a hurry.

    And I'd definitely try the sheet method again - since it was close to working. And I'd try a few practice runs - where you don't actually go anywhere in the car, you just practice getting loaded and unloaded.

    I was lucky with my dog - she gets car sick so she was never the least bit interested in eating any bit of car ever. touch wood. A friend's dog did a proper job on her car - seat foam everywhere. That was a cairn terrier cross.

    With my dog - to deal with the barking - I taught her to bark on cue. And so now it has value and is not to be wasted on nothing in particular. She was barking and bouncing off the fence in the back yard - for some reason she decided that was "fun". So I went out and caught her after one bouce where she landed a bit heavily and just held her until she showed some self control - she sat and her hackles went back down. And she has only done it one time since - a good two months later, and I went to go get her, and she stopped before I got there.

    Not sure how that applies to car. Maybe if he barks - get out the car and if he's still barking - take him out of the car too... and then repeat loading attempt. I know that if me and my siblings were having a screaming match on the back seat, and mum stopped the car - that got our attention. If we all had to bail out as well - that was a major attention getter.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nekhbet View Post
    Tyler needs a dog trainer ASAP. Sounds like the car is just too exciting and self rewarding for him and hence he needs to be in it all the time. Thunder shirts and bach flower are for anxiety, your dog has gone past that point.

    If you dont want to get a trainer in you will need to counter condition him. So number one, he can't go into the car unless he's calm and quiet. Don't let him rush in, he's only allowed to go in when he's quiet, then sit straight on the seat. Then call him out again before he goes nuts. Do this a few times at random intervals and please don't say things like 'Come on!' or 'Let's Go!' or anything that razzes him up. Dogs are creatures of pattern and habit, you have to break the old habits to change the behavior. Gradually keep doing that and no leaving the driveway until the dog is calm. I would be having someone sit next to the dog while he's in the car too in order to distract and reward him for not being a lunatic. Reinforce behaviors like 'drop' and 'lay down' and keep rewarding for the dog doing it.
    hi. thanks for the reply. he does not listen to any commands when i am in the car and just sitting on the seat. isnt this kind of confusing him or teasing him with me letting him in and out of the crate in the car preparing to go out? also i dont think i could do this in my driveway as my neighbours are really close by in the group of villas i live in. something for me to try perhaps in another area where people are not going to get annoyed with the constant loud barking.

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