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Thread: Houston We Have a Problem

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meegz View Post
    Tonight i asked him to get off -he wouldnt so i went to get him by the short leash he always wears as he has a habit of ignoring us and walking off when we ask him to do something and he raised his lips at me and tried to snap at me.
    How did you approach? Perhaps too firmly? Firm does not mean intimidating.

    Maybe approaching with leash in more calm non intimidating manner, with food lure? Rather than coming straight towards him with leash demanding to get off the bed ask him with a nice friendly voice offering him a treat and praising when he gets off. You have a dog with bad history and it takes time to get things right. Sometimes you will experience the feeling of going one step forward and two step backwards in training, but don't be discouraged, keep being calm and friendly even if you get annoyed sometimes. To get a dog obey you sometimes you need to play by his rules or better said - make him think so

    In my experience with the one I foster at the moment when I want him off I come to him as if I want to pet him, completely calm and in a friendly voice I say "off". If it doesn't work straight away I call him "come, let's go" with voice that invites to play and have fun. When he does, I really do have some play time (short) with lots of praising and a treat. I get what I want and he's happy and doesn't feel like he's at loss for losing his spot on the couch.

    my partner lets him get away with way to much IMHO but he gets full respect from the dog and arrow is very submissive towards him even though if he barks for attention he will get it from darryn, if he wants a treat he will get it from darryn without having to do anything for it!
    He's like that with Darrin because Darrin is more rewarding. And that's OK, but you should really have a talk and set things straight in regards to rewarding anything. If he gets rewarded for anything he will start taking advantage slowly for some things, any dog does it in one way or another (although some things are not easily noticable or important to owners). So, no treats for attention barking and no cuddles whenever he wants.

    Aggression towards men and strangers takes a lot of time, lots and lots of work and patience and lots and lots of positive experiences wit many different people/men/kids, preferably with the supervision of professional trainer/behaviourist.
    Respect and you shall be respected. Animal is always right.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazydog View Post
    I was reading the NILF techinic & realised without knowing I use it alot.
    LOL...Isn't it funny, I read it and thought the same. had no idea that is what it was called.
    I had to go the same path with our rescue newfs, especially Annabelle
    Pets are forever

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bundybear View Post
    My wife is an experienced security dog handler and I got her to read through my previous post (after I posted it) and she said in no uncertain terms that dog should not be in house and and even questioned the suitability of that dog for a pet.
    Without knowing the dogs full history there is no way to know if the dog was mistreated as a pup or if it was the result of bad breeding or even a combination of both.
    She said that the dog could bite at any time it feels threatened.
    At the very least your partner needs to adjust his attitude towards the dog and establish a pack hierarchy where you are higher than the dog, I hope there are no kids involved.

    She says if it were us it would be the dog or her, I'd have to make a choice.

    Sorry to sound so harsh, that's her opinion.

    You've been given some great advice by the members , I hope things get sorted out for you and for Arrow.

    I just need to reply to this post though.
    What do you mean not allowed in the house? As in never ? Because I feel that is ridiculous to offer a training method of banning the dog from the house,could you please explain to me how this is intended to help with aggression issues?
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    You've been given some great advice by the members , I hope things get sorted out for you and for Arrow.

    I just need to reply to this post though.
    What do you mean not allowed in the house? As in never ? Because I feel that is ridiculous to offer a training method of banning the dog from the house,could you please explain to me how this is intended to help with aggression issues?
    ridiculous ???
    Interesting way to greet someone you don't know

    We've got a thing about having an unreliable dog in the house that could kill one of our kids, but we're a bit weird like that.

    I didn't suggest that it would help with aggression issues I meant it for general safety.
    I will not allow a dog in my house that has aggression problems especially a 50 + kg dog that doesn't have a decent set of social skills. Our dogs earn the right to come inside and if they screw up they go out, it's a privilege not a right. Bad behaviour is not rewarded in our house.

  5. #15
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    I have a long history of owning and re-training rescue dogs.........the large newfie ones and the ones who had a history of being mistreated and very few good social skills. when the dogs are that large it can make the problem literally very dangerous.
    We are fully aware of the problem dogs we take on. We have no children and we live on a property.
    Hubby and I thought we were prepared and had the back ground to take on any rescue, UNTIL......Annabelle, she was totally out of control. very nice with me and always sweet with me, but she hated men and other dogs.
    We could not manage to retrain her by ourselves, we asked for help and it took some searching, our first behaviourist was a failure, but eventually we found a great Dogtrainer/ behaviourist who worked with all of us. Hubby, myself. Annabelle and our other dog to help Annabelle. He had a history of dealing with large dogs, though i have seen him with lots of small too
    We could never have done this without his help. Now since we have learned so much, i would take on another dog like her and we would, again under his guidance, do it again. But we really needed his help. And it was not overnight. It took six months of solid training, twice a week with him and twice a day at home doing good old fashioned obedience. Plus he guided us trough what i now realise is NILIF.
    He did advise us however not to "kick the dog out"......We kept her under containment inside, with us. Because our issue was also between our dogs, we actually had both dogs on lead all the time in the house. Umbilical system, which meant we were always aware of where they were and what they were doing. We had one dog each. the first month was literally "hell" for all of us.
    Therre is no easy path and I would never advise you with an aggressive dog over this media. i can only tell you that with help of someone who really has dealt with these kind of problems, seeing your dog in action, you might be able to change things for the better.
    Our Annabelle is now a gorgeous dog, but we are both very "strict", loving owners and we have agreed on the "rules for dogs" (and our horses) in our household. and we both try to do the same.
    I still do not trust Annabelle 100%, like I do my other newf. And I always am aware of what is happening around her. To possibly intervene, before anything might happen. because I think if a dog attacked her, she would loose it. Since our huge re-training, we have had one dog fight. Where another dog attacked her, unprovoked. Hubby and I were both there and because of all her training, we were able to stop it. Training is the only way and obedience training set the boundaries for a dog. It teaches dogs you are in charge and what you expect. I do not meant obedience in the sense that you can go out there and win Trials, I mean that the dogs do things when you ask for it.
    so this is long-winded, but I fell you should also know it can be done, but I feel only with help and lots of time and commitment.......Good luck

    PS I did notice you were using a behaviourist, what is there reading of all of this
    Last edited by newfsie; 12-26-2010 at 06:57 AM.
    Pets are forever

  6. #16

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    I can not agree with Newfie more, you really need a good trainer & more commitment & patience than you would ever imagine but the end results are more than worth it.
    I too disagree with not allowing the dog inside. Is there other dogs who do come in side?
    I would not have him lose inside at first but would use a crate a lead & a time out area to work on how he behaves inside. I agree bad behavour should not be rewarded but every dog has a right to feel secure, needed & have a dry safe area to sleep. OK if thats out side for all your dogs but to allow some the comfort & safety of the house but not others will cause you more problems. They want in to be a part of a pack & see the house as safety(like a den say) & it's not really his/her fault no one has taught him to behave in a house. Keep the dog on the outer of your pack & there is no way the behavour will improve.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazydog View Post
    I can not agree with Newfie more, you really need a good trainer & more commitment & patience than you would ever imagine but the end results are more than worth it.
    I too disagree with not allowing the dog inside. Is there other dogs who do come in side?
    I would not have him lose inside at first but would use a crate a lead & a time out area to work on how he behaves inside. I agree bad behavour should not be rewarded but every dog has a right to feel secure, needed & have a dry safe area to sleep. OK if thats out side for all your dogs but to allow some the comfort & safety of the house but not others will cause you more problems. They want in to be a part of a pack & see the house as safety(like a den say) & it's not really his/her fault no one has taught him to behave in a house. Keep the dog on the outer of your pack & there is no way the behavour will improve.




    Thankyou Crazy



    You put it in a much less confronting way than I did .
    It is one of my bugbears the keeping the dog out of the family enviroment/safety/pack as a form of punishment. The dog certainly has no idea its being 'punished' Dog just see's that other members are allowed the saftey of the 'home' and he is not. As you say,it just creates more problems.

    Its upto you the owner to help/correct whatever behaviour seems to be a problem ,inside or out! Banishing the dog outside does not and will not 'fix' or help to fix any behavioural issues.

    ps; Opening poster ; do you have a muzzle by any chance?
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  8. #18
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    I would have used a crate with Annabelle, but that was out of the question, because she was kept in one almost 24/24 in her previous life. She is still terrified of crates. but i am a supporter of positive crate use, where it is a good place for the dog to be. though you would need a HUGE one
    Pets are forever

  9. #19
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    Actually Newfsie, Danes are easier to 'fit' into crates than Newfs, :-P There is a 48 inch extra large size, maybe even a 52. My wolfhound was comfortable in the 48- seriously though, that's big enough to park a small car in, ha ha ha!

    But I digress...

    Just wanted to add that allowing your dog inside inside, especially if you intend to have him inside later on, will benefit the relationship building within your 'pack'. I don't have alot more to offer beyond what the other members have said except that controlling inside priviledges is a useful addition to your behaviorists recommendations & the strategies suggested here.

    That said, if you can't use a crate with this dog and don't want to put him in a separate room, you can get large playpens (yes, big enough for a Dane) and pop in a three seated couch or dog cushion (!!!!!!) and use that space instead of letting him have carte blanche... I have one for my Dobes, I have it 'doing' 2 sides if a rectangular slate area, walls border the other two sides and I was able to secure it to the walls to give greater strength.

    The other most important thing is consistency and unity between you and your hubby.
    Last edited by Villain & Flirtt; 12-26-2010 at 04:29 PM.

  10. #20
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    Hi Guys,

    Well long time no chat and i saw this thread getting fiery so i decided to opt out as i would have argued with people!

    Arrow is doing much better - he is on anti anxiety meds and has almost become a non guarder and non reactive around other dogs - However fear of mean is still an issue with some types of men (unfortunatley he is still terrified of my dad and my dad terrified of him!)

    We have gotten so far that we were even invited to a seminar with Kathy Kopellis Mcleod (a huge thanks to her) We have been using her as our new trainer and shes left our old trainer lying in the dust so to speak - without her im sure we would have put arrow to sleep. We attend her reactive rover classes and she has given us some great tips on his guarding as well. Now if he only sometimes guards his bed or if he gets on the couch and isnt supposed too - usually its just a growl and walk off (it got to a full on attack if you even approached him at one point -thankgod he has good bite inhibition!) We are still working on a few issues but we have a pretty relaxed and happy dog these days and the house is harmonious now!

    However his behaviour at the vet is another thing! lol but atleast that i can work on as i work there and he is happy to wear a muzzle while there

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