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Thread: Advice Needed.

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    Adelaide
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    12,581

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    ClickStart

    Belle

    It seems like you forgot to "charge the clicker" ie click treat click treat click treat (repeat 20 to 30 times) and it also seems like you might need some clicker timing practice. Gary Wilkes - as per link, suggests throwing a ball in the air and trying to click when it's at the top of its arc, when it lands and again for any bounces. It's not easy but practice helps you get better, and the better your timing, the less confused your dog will be.

    Initially you do have to treat for every click but eventually you can string actions together and click each one and only treat at the end. Or treat randomly.

    If you're worried about how many treats your dog is getting, cut them up into smaller bits. And ideally the treat should be something soft like cheese or sausage or a bit of roast meat, and small is about 1/4 the size of a five cent piece and as thick as two five cent pieces, and even smaller for a small dog.

    I tend to work in five minute sessions or as long as my dog stays focussed. I count out 20 to 30 treats for what ever task we're working on eg remote drop, and we practice until I run out of treats. And I try to up the standard every five treats to ten treats or so, ie she's getting it rightish, then only treat when she gets it really right.

    So for remote drop, intially (I don't use clicker much) but I mark (Click or good dog) for when she "waits" in place, and again when she comes when I call, and again when she drops when I signal, and she gets an average treat for dropping at my feet after the signal and a bit of roast beef if she drops the instant I signal - ie away from me. But you have to click the drop when she drops and then walk up to her to deliver the treat.

    And just to stop the recall from becoming drops only, we practice the standard one as well.

    The other thing I'm working on is clipping nails. So I tell her good for every time she lets me touch her nails with the clipper and when she holds her paw steady instead of trying to get it away from me. And really good treat for when she allows me to clip or hold her on her back in my lap and put the clipper around her nail. We're still working on the lap dog thing, she's not real keen on me putting her upside down but won't do it for herself yet.

    How long it takes for your dog to connect click with good dog/treat/ warm fuzzy feeling depends a bit on your dog. Charging the clicker usually takes several sessions ie 30 treats times three sessions, usually like one morning, one night, one the next morning. You can tell it's working when your dog starts doing tricks voluntarily in the hope of getting a click/treat.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyacinth View Post
    ClickStart

    Belle

    It seems like you forgot to "charge the clicker" ie click treat click treat click treat (repeat 20 to 30 times) and it also seems like you might need some clicker timing practice. Gary Wilkes - as per link, suggests throwing a ball in the air and trying to click when it's at the top of its arc, when it lands and again for any bounces. It's not easy but practice helps you get better, and the better your timing, the less confused your dog will be.

    Initially you do have to treat for every click but eventually you can string actions together and click each one and only treat at the end. Or treat randomly.
    Hi,

    Yeah I do the "charge the clicker" thing.

    I was given a sample of liver treats from Pet Stock when I bought the clicker so I have been using them and have been looking for an alternative for when these run out. Any suggestions?

    The timing practice sounds good, although I am still clicking at the exact moment her body hits the floor, this is when she has "dropped". This is when I should be clicking, correct?

    Thanks for the link.



    Will try and get some pics of our clicker training, if this doesn't distract her.

    Thanks again, Hyacinth.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belle View Post
    Hi,

    Yeah I do the "charge the clicker" thing.

    I was given a sample of liver treats from Pet Stock when I bought the clicker so I have been using them and have been looking for an alternative for when these run out. Any suggestions?

    The timing practice sounds good, although I am still clicking at the exact moment her body hits the floor, this is when she has "dropped". This is when I should be clicking, correct?

    Thanks for the link.



    Will try and get some pics of our clicker training, if this doesn't distract her.

    Thanks again, Hyacinth.
    For your treats Happy Paws Training Treats - home

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemiannic View Post
    Thanks Boh!

    Will order some off there when I run out of these liver treats.

    Do you know of any shops/sites that give out samples? I would like to try them before I buy them as I don't want to spend a whole lot of money and then she doesn't like them.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belle View Post
    Thanks Boh!

    Will order some off there when I run out of these liver treats.

    Do you know of any shops/sites that give out samples? I would like to try them before I buy them as I don't want to spend a whole lot of money and then she doesn't like them.
    I think you will find lots of testimonials on them in the forum.
    They are made by GSDs4EVER!

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemiannic View Post
    I think you will find lots of testimonials on them in the forum.
    They are made by GSDs4EVER!
    Really? I trust they are good then! Just had a look at the piccies on the site and lots of dogs seem to like them so they must taste alright.

    Thanks again, Boh!

    I'm off to do some searching in the forums!

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Sydney
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    1,048

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    I also have a question regarding clicker training, and maybe it will be useful for Belle... when you do stop giving the treats after clicking? So far Belle is giving treats after the click, but when does this stop?

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Masha View Post
    I also have a question regarding clicker training, and maybe it will be useful for Belle... when you do stop giving the treats after clicking? So far Belle is giving treats after the click, but when does this stop?
    Thanks, was wondering this lol..

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Sydney
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    2,032

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    The clicker is a training tool once the exercise is learnt then you wean off using the clicker and the reward. You are now starting to look for improvements.

    Weaning off

    Sit, click, reward, release
    Sit, click, reward, release
    Sit, release - don't hesitate move on quickly don't give the dog time to think why it didn't get a reward.
    Sit, click, reward, release

    Get it to every second exercise the dog gets a reward, I, like some trainers will click or in my case say yes every so often and not reward, some trainers will never click unless they follow up with a reward but if the dog does it quicker, neater I will both click and reward with a jackpot. The stakes have now risen and you are now rewarding only sits better than the last one.

    If you don't move on you will have a dog that will only work when food is present.

    Hope this makes sense.

    Re-read Hyc post it also points out when to stop clicking and treating.

    But in a nut shell once the basics are learnt then move onto only clicking and rewarding improvements otherwise the dog will always give you mediocre work.

    Or again as pointed out in Hyc post, string together more than one exerise sit - click, drop - click, heel - click, sit - click, reward. You are now stringing together exercises that the dog knows but it it working on faith that a reward will be worth coming. I alway say to people think of a poker machine, you keep putting in money in the hope that it will pay. However if you go to a vending machine you put money in and you always get something for your money.

    In the beginning when the dog is learning the exercise it is a vending machine, as the exercise become learnt the dog is now a poker machine.
    Last edited by mouseandchicken; 04-16-2010 at 08:31 AM.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    SE Suburbs - Melbourne
    Posts
    487

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    Quote Originally Posted by mouseandchicken View Post
    The clicker is a training tool once the exercise is learnt then you wean off using the clicker and the reward. You are now starting to look for improvements.

    Weaning off

    Sit, click, reward, release
    Sit, click, reward, release
    Sit, release - don't hesitate move on quickly don't give the dog time to think why it didn't get a reward.
    Sit, click, reward, release

    Get it to every second exercise the dog gets a reward, I, like some trainers will click or in my case say yes every so often and not reward, some trainers will never click unless they follow up with a reward but if the dog does it quicker, neater I will both click and reward with a jackpot. The stakes have now risen and you are now rewarding only sits better than the last one.

    If you don't move on you will have a dog that will only work when food is present.

    Hope this makes sense.

    Re-read Hyc post it also points out when to stop clicking and treating.

    But in a nut shell once the basics are learnt then move onto only clicking and rewarding improvements otherwise the dog will always give you mediocre work.

    Or again as pointed out in Hyc post, string together more than one exerise sit - click, drop - click, heel - click, sit - click, reward. You are now stringing together exercises that the dog knows but it it working on faith that a reward will be worth coming. I alway say to people think of a poker machine, you keep putting in money in the hope that it will pay. However if you go to a vending machine you put money in and you always get something for your money.

    In the beginning when the dog is learning the exercise it is a vending machine, as the exercise become learnt the dog is now a poker machine.
    MAC I love that..... But your right.... I am up to fazing the treat out with some of my exercises... I will keep this in mind
    Dogs Aren't Our Whole Lives, But They Make Our Lives Whole


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