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Thread: Prong Collars, Why?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussiemyf7 View Post
    Humane doesn't mean human standards FYI
    K9: how about you tell me what you think it means in terms of dog training & behaviour modification then?
    Steve Courtney, K9 Pro - The K9 Professionals

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  2. #12
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    My OMG in the other thread was first gut reaction to the look of it. I think many training methods work, there is not one hard and fast way of doing things. Some dogs react well with treats and positive reinforcement, others can be so headstrong that maybe other methods need to be used.

    My Hubby's family have been farmers for yonks, have had many working dogs. None have ever needed harsh measures, till now.
    Boris (blue heeler) refused to react to any measures when being too aggressive with the cattle.
    FIL has always hated electric collars but decided this was better to try first instead of shooting him.

    Boris no longer needs the collar and works so well and happily.
    Wouldn't trust him at all on the loose with the cattle, sheep or cats but when working them he is fantastic.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by k9force View Post
    K9: Well I dont rememeber saying that I thought the prong was the only tool that could be used, but whilst were talking on the subject., what tools are better, in your opinion of course.




    K9: Well dogs are hedonists, pleasure seekiung & pain avoiding,. when you have a dog that already has a path to success & offering better rewards isnt an option, to guide a dog into the learning mode & create behaviour plasticity, discomfort is the only option.

    The Gentle Leader if standard 'short least training' doesn't work.

    In my view, its controlling the dog through punishment, which isn't neccessary. If the dog pulls, it gets pinched. I believe training through praise rather than punishment is a better way to go about things.
    They have also been proven to cause injuries and trauma on the dogs neck, more specifically, their trachea.
    Yes, most likely because they were used incorrectly but so what? Only 'experianced' people can use it? I don't think 'unexperienced' people should be encouraged to use them then.
    Education not Legislation

  4. #14
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    I've heard alot about these collars, I'd love to be able to try one with Madeline. I've tried many different things with her but still find walking her an absolute nightmare to the point I feel like crying at the thought of taking her out.

  5. #15

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    Thanks for the great info, k9force!

  6. #16
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    I cannot believe my ears/eyes!! How can you love a dog and hurt it at the same time? I just watched the Video posted here about Christian the Lion. Obviously trained with lots of love and care... It is the ONLY way. K9 it is a business that you run. The more misbehaved and problematic the dogs are, the better for you!
    I said that Mimi's papers stated that she is a Bull Terrier because Bull Terriers are meant to be fierce and yet she isn't. I have not used ANY method to train her. My method was the same as I was with my children when they were little. Firm but gentle guidance.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimi1 View Post
    I cannot believe my ears/eyes!! How can you love a dog and hurt it at the same time? I just watched the Video posted here about Christian the Lion. Obviously trained with lots of love and care... It is the ONLY way. K9 it is a business that you run. The more misbehaved and problematic the dogs are, the better for you!
    I said that Mimi's papers stated that she is a Bull Terrier because Bull Terriers are meant to be fierce and yet she isn't. I have not used ANY method to train her. My method was the same as I was with my children when they were little. Firm but gentle guidance.
    There is no only way. Maybe if owners could get control of their dogs on their own K9 wouldn't need to run this business. But we have so many uncontrolled, unsocialized, untrained dogs running around that it's a blessing that we have professional dog trainers who can help.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussiemyf7 View Post
    The Gentle Leader if standard 'short least training' doesn't work.
    K9: Hmm I specifically asked what tools do work in yoiur opiniuon & you reply with what doesnt work?

    If the dog pulls, it gets pinched.
    K9: well that would be one way of using them yes but why not train the dog not to pull rather than let the tool do all the work?

    I believe training through praise rather than punishment is a better way to go about things.

    K9" Ok but suggest you have a dog that finds pulling toward something else more valuebale than your praise? what then?

    They have also been proven to cause injuries and trauma on the dogs neck, more specifically, their trachea.
    K9: If your talking about a head halter or gentle leader, then yes I agree, but prongs have not been proven to cause any damage at all.


    Yes, most likely because they were used incorrectly but so what? Only 'experianced' people can use it? I don't think 'unexperienced' people should be encouraged to use them then.
    K9: I come to the nemndof your post b& winder if your talkimng about a gentle leader or a prong collar?

    To clarify, head halters can cause neck injuries prong collars cant.

    I dont think anyone should buy any tool & use it on a dog without guidance.
    Steve Courtney, K9 Pro - The K9 Professionals

    www.k9pro.com.au

    Official Forum Trainer and Behaviourist

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bordeaux View Post
    I've heard alot about these collars, I'd love to be able to try one with Madeline. I've tried many different things with her but still find walking her an absolute nightmare to the point I feel like crying at the thought of taking her out.
    K9: We have many DDBs in for trainimng & some of them end up being trained on a prong collar, the results are amazing. You should try one with guidance...

    Where are you located?
    Steve Courtney, K9 Pro - The K9 Professionals

    www.k9pro.com.au

    Official Forum Trainer and Behaviourist

  10. #20
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    hear hear Aussie. Liza, there was a thread on this forum about training the owners rather than the dogs. That 99% of the time it is the owners' fault if the dog is unruly! I believe this to be true. I have had dogs all my life. Throughout my childhood we had Dobermann and later when I married, I had a poodle, a Fox Terrier, a Pomeranian, a Jack Russell and Mimi who is of medium size and believed to be part Bull Terrier and part Jack Russell (she is too tall to be either). Your dog responds to YOU. YOU are the one to set its temperament right and curb its excesses. To use force is to be cruel. It is as simple as that.
    Perhaps many who have problems are first time owners of a pet who choose the wrong pet. Having a GSD or a Rottwheiler as a pet for the first time is not a sensible thing to do. I know a lady who got herself a GR female dog as she needed companionship. She never owned a pet of any kind in her life. It was the most gentle and most beautiful specimen you could find UNTIL she took it to training at a Commando type place. From an angel, this dog became so agressive, showed its teeth and bit her each time she put her hand close. She would sit on her (as she was taught at the commando class!) until she stopped growling!!!! I HATED HER. That was a BEAUTIFUL dog!!! She ruined it. It had reached the point where the dog had lost all trust in her. She was going to put it down. Then, by some miracle, she stopped taking her to those classes and decided to be gentler with her so as to regain her trust. The GR is ok now but still growls when you pet her. If it was a child, you would call it abuse.
    Last edited by Mimi1; 11-12-2009 at 06:18 PM.

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