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Thread: BARF Diet and How to Balance It???

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela's Gone Batty View Post
    Sorry Cleas! My mistake, I'm so confused!

    Ok, Meals I've worked out for Batty - this is just an idea that I have and I'm not going shopping for it till Monday lol.

    Breakfast - Chicken mince (the carcasses)
    Morning Tea - 1 chicken wing mid morning (breakfast here is 5am!
    Lunchtime - a little bit of kibble for the first few weeks to be replaced with I don't know what yet!
    Dinnertime - Beef mince, mashed/minced veggies combined together with 1 egg + microwaved shell ground up.

    Does that sound ok?
    How old is Batty again, Angela? Only VERY young puppies need to be fed four times a day. 3 would be an absolute maximum, and I do mean absolute.

    If you are going to feed raw, what's with the kibble added in the middle of it all? Not sure about that, that's a non-no to me, but that's just my opinion.

    Now as for the egg, not every day. It's like this, you will find that ppl like Anne and others who feed eggs (and shells) to their dogs, will do so on a day when the dog is not getting their daily calcium from anything else, such as bones etc.

    BUT, and this is a big but, bones are a huge portion of a truly raw natural diet.

    Just my thoughts...

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne View Post
    I hope Batty is a pup?? If not, there is no need to feed that often or that amount.

    1 or 2 meals maximum per day is all that is needed. True (read: zealous) natural feeders will even feed only every other day sometimes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    How old is Batty again, Angela? Only VERY young puppies need to be fed four times a day. 3 would be an absolute maximum, and I do mean absolute.

    If you are going to feed raw, what's with the kibble added in the middle of it all? Not sure about that, that's a non-no to me, but that's just my opinion.

    Now as for the egg, not every day. It's like this, you will find that ppl like Anne and others who feed eggs (and shells) to their dogs, will do so on a day when the dog is not getting their daily calcium from anything else, such as bones etc.

    BUT, and this is a big but, bones are a huge portion of a truly raw natural diet.

    Just my thoughts...
    Still just a baby, he's 14 weeks old. His day starts at 4am and finishes at 9:30pm - obviously he's not awake for all of that but he only sleeps about 3 hours. When he's awake he is very active, I've found that I'm feeding nearly twice the amount of kibble as recommended and he's losing a bit of weight. I've been adding some mince to the kibble which helped a lot for slowing him down.

    He only weighs 7.3 kgs at the moment, so it'd be tiny little bits. I thought the chicken carcass mince would count as bones?

    Ok, Egg once a week Can do! Thank you!

    Cleas:

    Also...I am giving mine with their evening meal:
    1 salmon oil capsule
    1 teaspoon Kelp powder
    1 tablespoon natural yoghurt
    1 teaspoon Organic Appple Cider Vinegar with "mother"
    1 teaspoon extra virgin olive oil
    1 500mg Vitamin C tablet (crushed)
    Given that Batty is so young would I need to do this or less or more of them? This is all part of the confusion for me!

    I can't thank all of you enough for your patience with me either.

  3. #53
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    he's being wormed regularly i assume Angela? Please don't take offence to such an obviously dumb question on my behalf, but best to check IMO.

    What kibble have you been feeding him? And he's losing weight? Or is he growing in height?

    You could substitue a meal here and there with nice raw fish, or a tin of sardines, they often love that.

    remember that offal given here and there is great food, VERY rich in vitamins and minerals and some offal is exceedingly good for muscle mass building.

    I think the hard part for all of us (well I admit it's hard for me) is that we can ALL give you our personal advice and tell you what we each feed etc, but all of that information will be different.
    For example, some of the things Cleas feeds/gives I won't, and visa versa - some of the things I do Cleas and others wouldn't.

    For example = pork. MAC woulnd't feed pork in a blue moon, and I suspect many others here wouldn't either. Yet, I have researched the benefits and risks of pork for many, many years, and am very much an advocate of pork in dogs that are suitable for it.
    Do you see what I'm trying to say in my normally long-winded way?

    Only you can decide what you take on board, what you agree with and what you don't.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    he's being wormed regularly i assume Angela? Please don't take offence to such an obviously dumb question on my behalf, but best to check IMO.
    Yup and all is definitely clear in that department - it wasn't when I first got him though...


    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    What kibble have you been feeding him? And he's losing weight? Or is he growing in height?
    Definitely losing weight. When I weighed him last week he was 8.4kgs now he's 7.3kgs (weighed at the vets on Wednesday)

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    You could substitue a meal here and there with nice raw fish, or a tin of sardines, they often love that.
    He can have fish nights once a fortnight with me!

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    remember that offal given here and there is great food, VERY rich in vitamins and minerals and some offal is exceedingly good for muscle mass building.
    I've bought some liver to chop up and see if he likes it tomorrow - bought tonight when I got a hot chicken for dinner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    I think the hard part for all of us (well I admit it's hard for me) is that we can ALL give you our personal advice and tell you what we each feed etc, but all of that information will be different.
    For example, some of the things Cleas feeds/gives I won't, and visa versa - some of the things I do Cleas and others wouldn't.

    For example = pork. MAC woulnd't feed pork in a blue moon, and I suspect many others here wouldn't either. Yet, I have researched the benefits and risks of pork for many, many years, and am very much an advocate of pork in dogs that are suitable for it.
    Do you see what I'm trying to say in my normally long-winded way?

    Only you can decide what you take on board, what you agree with and what you don't.
    I definitely see where you're coming from, and I know it's going to take a little bit of finding where he's at and what works for him and I as well. While a lot of what you do is different there is a fair bit that is either the same or very similar which are the points I'm finding to be the most helpful. It's helping me clear up my head and work out where I want to go with it.

    ETA: He's being fed a mix of Supercoat Puppy and Advance Puppy Growth. Supercoat wasn't giving him enough (very flat and not very energetic) but Advance was too rich (went straight through him when it got to more than 40% of his diet), it's 60% Supercoat and 40% Advance.
    Last edited by Angela's Gone Batty; 01-29-2010 at 09:24 PM. Reason: To add kibble details!

  5. #55
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    Yes Angela, Supercoat is not the best quality in my opinion. Having to mix the different commercial dry foods to get one that doesn't affect him in those ways is not a good alternative for you to have to do.

    If you continue to feed kibble at any stage, you might want to consider Pro-Plan working dog formula, as it sounds like he may have a high metabolism rate and is obviously extremely active. That is a kibble that many ppl have had great success with for those particular reasons.

    What I do is all the same in the end as many here, but I guess it's just a different way of looking at things. I mean, I do give dogs mince and cut up meat on a daily basis, but I'm adamant they also must use the teeth they were given to do the job they were designed for - which is to chew, gnaw and rip apart their food. Ppl often fail to consider that it is not just about the natural cleaning action for the teeth, it is also about working the digestive jiuces as they were meant to work, and developing strong jaw muscle, amongst other things.

    I have always owned GSD's prior to Inca. Sure, big dogs, strong dogs...but, I also see the tiniest Chihuahua or toy poodle as exactly what it is - A DOG. And I strongly believe that they need that chewing, ripping action and all it gives just as much as the biggest dog out there.

    Hope that makes sense.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    Yes Angela, Supercoat is not the best quality in my opinion. Having to mix the different commercial dry foods to get one that doesn't affect him in those ways is not a good alternative for you to have to do.

    If you continue to feed kibble at any stage, you might want to consider Pro-Plan working dog formula, as it sounds like he may have a high metabolism rate and is obviously extremely active. That is a kibble that many ppl have had great success with for those particular reasons.

    What I do is all the same in the end as many here, but I guess it's just a different way of looking at things. I mean, I do give dogs mince and cut up meat on a daily basis, but I'm adamant they also must use the teeth they were given to do the job they were designed for - which is to chew, gnaw and rip apart their food. Ppl often fail to consider that it is not just about the natural cleaning action for the teeth, it is also about working the digestive jiuces as they were meant to work, and developing strong jaw muscle, amongst other things.

    I have always owned GSD's prior to Inca. Sure, big dogs, strong dogs...but, I also see the tiniest Chihuahua or toy poodle as exactly what it is - A DOG. And I strongly believe that they need that chewing, ripping action and all it gives just as much as the biggest dog out there.

    Hope that makes sense.
    Supercoat and Advance are both crap IMO, but at least he doesn't have the runs every day. I don't want to continue feeding kibble at all as frankly I can't see how the dogs enjoy it (). I agree completely with the dogs having to do what they were designed to do. All of the bones I've ever given have quite a lot of meat on them for this reason, and I do give relatively large bones (relative to the dogs size that is).

    Quote Originally Posted by Cleasanta View Post
    The problem with mixing supercoat and advance is....when you measure the food off....supercoat tell you how to measure it as per puppy's weight/age as it is right now...advance tell you to measure as per what you think Batty's adult weight will be...if you get my drift. The FIRST ingredient in advance is (from what I can remember) CORN, which dogs can not digest...they both contain by-products which could be ANY sort of garbage!

    The supplement I give mine as per the list can be given from 3 months of age.
    The only reason he was on Supercoat at all was because that is what the rescue group were feeding. I don't like advance or any of the other kibbles that can be bought from the vets etc, I never have, but I'm only just learning that there's more choice than that.

    Yay! Ok, so now I know what to get and what to buy my shopping list is looking more complete! With the Sascha's Blend - where do you get it?

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne View Post
    I hope Batty is a pup?? If not, there is no need to feed that often or that amount.

    1 or 2 meals maximum per day is all that is needed. True (read: zealous) natural feeders will even feed only every other day sometimes.
    Anne, do you mean that natural feeders will only feed a meal every other day or will only feed a natural meal every alternate day and commercial on the other day? Doesn't take much to confuse me lol
    SPR fosters:Rowland, Matrix, Mia, Arizona, Romeo, Wrinkles, George, Molly, Su Lin, Ellie, Charlie, Charlotte, Lulu, Montana http://www.sharpeirescue.com.au

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela's Gone Batty View Post
    Supercoat and Advance are both crap IMO, but at least he doesn't have the runs every day. I don't want to continue feeding kibble at all as frankly I can't see how the dogs enjoy it (). I agree completely with the dogs having to do what they were designed to do. All of the bones I've ever given have quite a lot of meat on them for this reason, and I do give relatively large bones (relative to the dogs size that is).


    The only reason he was on Supercoat at all was because that is what the rescue group were feeding. I don't like advance or any of the other kibbles that can be bought from the vets etc, I never have, but I'm only just learning that there's more choice than that.

    Yay! Ok, so now I know what to get and what to buy my shopping list is looking more complete! With the Sascha's Blend - where do you get it?
    Hello....my 2c worth..... If you are feeding kibble, look at the back of the pack and ensure that the first 3 ingrediants are NOT corn/cereals/crap. The ingrediants are listed in order of "most" withing the recipe. If Batty is loosing weight you may want to try him on Evo. Expensive but absolutely full of protien. You can buy from Pet Goods Direct or Pets Paradise (yes, I know - but these are the only importers of the product). I would also consider Innova which has Brown rice listed in the ingredients. It was Evo that stacked all that weight on Gomez 2 weeks, so I guarantee it works. As DA says......just my opinion!! lol

    As to Sachas Blend, yes its good but Glyde is better! Sacha's is an older product than Glyde. The is one thing you need to consider here and that is both of these products use green tipped muscle which is "broken down" at extreme heat. Therefore it will take about 2 months before you can start to see any results kick in. I am now using PAW Osteo which is crushed green tipped muscle and kicks in after about 2 weeks. It is also substancially cheaper than Glyde. 80 tablets for about $40 as opposed to about $120 for a tub of Glyde. Both products are only available at vets.
    SPR fosters:Rowland, Matrix, Mia, Arizona, Romeo, Wrinkles, George, Molly, Su Lin, Ellie, Charlie, Charlotte, Lulu, Montana http://www.sharpeirescue.com.au

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shar Pei Rescue Victoria View Post
    Anne, do you mean that natural feeders will only feed a meal every other day or will only feed a natural meal every alternate day and commercial on the other day? Doesn't take much to confuse me lol
    I expect Anne meant that truly natural (zealous) feeders feed their dogs every second day. No commercial food whatsoever.

    A dog in the wild will NOT usually eat every day. Does not need to, anyway.

    I think that is very much what Anne would have meant, Shar.

  10. #60
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    I'm feeding my young whippets (not the babies) on Evo as Shar suggested combined with Pro Plan Sensitive. Because with all the crap they eat, lizards, grubs etc they would often get a bit of an upset stomach here and there and also because they play together so often they were running of their food.

    I found the Evo added the weight and the Sensitive (Salmon) kept their digestive system in order.

    They still get raw bones once a week - Beef.

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