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Thread: OMG my next door neighbor has bought a red nosed pit bull!!!!

  1. #261

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    Di summed it up pretty simply and straight forward.

    Mosh where is the Justice in letting one dog owner that killed a child (smaller) get less than the big dog owner ?

    Regardless of risk factors leading up to the attack , the outcome was still the same. Both dogs killed someone.

    Its like saying , ok well my neighbor has this little,fine, Kelpie cross and I have a big bad Pit Bull , if I follow your logic and both these dogs ever harm someone , then I'm going to cop more repercussions than my neighbor .
    Sorry , but that's not how laws should work. Next think we know everyone will be out there buying the smaller dogs but treating ( or ignoring) just the same but it is really ok because hey! Smaller dog = lesser penalty.
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  2. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    Di summed it up pretty simply and straight forward.

    Mosh where is the Justice in letting one dog owner that killed a child (smaller) get less than the big dog owner ?

    Regardless of risk factors leading up to the attack , the outcome was still the same. Both dogs killed someone.

    Its like saying , ok well my neighbor has this little,fine, Kelpie cross and I have a big bad Pit Bull , if I follow your logic and both these dogs ever harm someone , then I'm going to cop more repercussions than my neighbor .
    Sorry , but that's not how laws should work. Next think we know everyone will be out there buying the smaller dogs but treating ( or ignoring) just the same but it is really ok because hey! Smaller dog = lesser penalty.
    And our laws don't work like that, which is a good thing. If someone murders someone one with a shotgun, they are subject to to same law and repercussions as if they had murdered them with the smaller blade on a Swiss army knife. The culpability is the same.

    Likewise for dog owners; we should bear equal responsibility for our dogs. For example, we all know that we should pick up our dog's poo if they poop in a public place and we all do. The fine for not cleaning up after your dog is the same, no matter whether you have a Chi (small poop LOL) or Newfoundland (big poop LOL). The issue really is that simple.

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

  3. #263

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    Quote Originally Posted by mymatejack View Post
    and what about the poor owner of big dog who kills little yap yap fluff ball because little yap yap fluff ball attacked big dog and big dog gets blamed and pts???

    What needs to happen is every dog owner needs to be held responsible for their dogs actions and they need to know they will be held responsible, whether its some little yap yap fluff ball or a big evil pitbull.

    The idea that some breeds of dogs are safe is exactly how we ended up with BSL, and that's why we continue to see attacks from dogs like labradors, cause stupid owners think their breed of dog is safe and don't see the need to be a responsible owner.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloz View Post
    I mentioned the scenario you describe and that the small dog owner would be at fault. Just like the cyclist riding in the middle of the road puts himself at risk of getting mowed down by a car.

    I never said anything about certain breeds, so I do not know why you compare it to BSL. I am talking about size. I am opposed to BSL because it is based on absolutely nothing and does not work. Though surely you could admit that if you ban all dogs other than ankle biters, the serious bite injury rate would plummet dramatically? I AM NOT suggesting we do this!

    BSL is based on the false belief that those breeds have a tendency to be aggressive to humans. I don't think anyone participating in this discussion shares this belief.

    The rest of the discussion is about dog aggression. And that is where the opinions seem to differ. There is a. the question of whether or not APBT are more prone to being dog aggressive, b. if they are, is this mainly caused because they attract more irresponsible owners than other breeds and c. if they show a tendency to be dog aggressive regardless of how they are raised or compared to other dogs raised in similar conditions, does it justify banning the breed.
    What you didn't address is a very common scenario where little yap yap fluff ball starts the fight but no one witnesses that and big evil pitbull is automatically assumed to be at fault.

    Why do i compare what you say to BSL? Because like it or not, you are effectively talking about SSL(size specific legislation) - even though you say we shouldn't do it, that's what you are talking about!

    You really failed to address my 2nd and 3rd paragraphs which is where the crux of the real discussion lies
    Last edited by mymatejack; 12-21-2012 at 09:54 PM.

  4. #264

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    Di summed it up pretty simply and straight forward.

    Mosh where is the Justice in letting one dog owner that killed a child (smaller) get less than the big dog owner ?
    When both owners buy the dog, there is a risk factor that is considered. If there's a type of person who just leaves their dog in the backyard and doesn't train or discipline it, (and there are a hell of a lot of people like this) I would prefer if they got a smaller less powerful dog rather than a huge dog with a strong bite. Like I said before, it's almost like the two dogs could be classified as different species, it's like punishing the owner of a house cat and the owner of a tiger equally.

    It's like asking where is the justice in fining an 18 wheeler semitrailer more than a small hatchback, for speeding? The answer again is risk factor and potential for damage.

    I understand that the owners of large powerful dogs may feel discriminated against in this kind of discussion, but you can't tell me that when you bought your dog, you did not weigh up the risks.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    Its like saying , ok well my neighbor has this little,fine, Kelpie cross and I have a big bad Pit Bull , if I follow your logic and both these dogs ever harm someone , then I'm going to cop more repercussions than my neighbor .
    Sorry , but that's not how laws should work. Next think we know everyone will be out there buying the smaller dogs but treating ( or ignoring) just the same but it is really ok because hey! Smaller dog = lesser penalty.
    Well, it was more concerning the tiny dogs that have an extremely low risk factor. A kelpie still has quite a strong bite.

  5. #265

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    Yes but it was the outcome of the matter .

    As for when I got them ?
    Well in all seriousness , no , not really , I didn't sit and think "oh , I have a big dog so I'd better be ready to cop more than a little dog does if he gets in to any trouble".
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  6. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosh View Post
    When both owners buy the dog, there is a risk factor that is considered. If there's a type of person who just leaves their dog in the backyard and doesn't train or discipline it, (and there are a hell of a lot of people like this) I would prefer if they got a smaller less powerful dog rather than a huge dog with a strong bite. Like I said before, it's almost like the two dogs could be classified as different species, it's like punishing the owner of a house cat and the owner of a tiger equally.

    It's like asking where is the justice in fining an 18 wheeler semitrailer more than a small hatchback, for speeding? The answer again is risk factor and potential for damage.

    I understand that the owners of large powerful dogs may feel discriminated against in this kind of discussion, but you can't tell me that when you bought your dog, you did not weigh up the risks.



    Well, it was more concerning the tiny dogs that have an extremely low risk factor. A kelpie still has quite a strong bite.
    I have to agree; kelpies can do a lot of damage

    WestAust4.10.05.jpg

    Pit bulls can too; check out the face of this little toddler who was "savagely attacked and shaken like a toy"

    WestAust9.6.05small.jpg

    On the face of it though (pun intended) I'd far rather my child didn't get bitten by either dog. I only let my 7 year old grandson play with my pit bull, not with my kelpie/corgi/dingo/ferret cross. And he only gets to play with Hobbes (pit bull) under strict and close supervision. You can never be totally confident that the child won't do something awful to the dog.

    Lizzie (my cream kelpie/dingo/corgi bitsa) weighs some 17kg while Hobbes weighs 26kg. She is far more likely to bite a human than Hobbes is. However, I ensure that none of my dogs bite humans or attack other dogs (rats however are fair game). It really isn't that hard to do what you need to do.

    However, I have to take issue with this statement

    Like I said before, it's almost like the two dogs could be classified as different species, it's like punishing the owner of a house cat and the owner of a tiger equally.
    I am sorry, but I have to say that the statement is a bit over the top and really can't be allowed to go unchallenged. Comparing house cats to tigers, and then trying to suggest that small dogs and larger dogs should be viewed similarly is just a tad extreme. Tigers weigh around 300kg and the average cat weighs 4kg. American Pit Bull Terriers weigh around 28kg, and Chi's weigh up to 3kg. You are comparing apples and water melons.

    Regards,

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

  7. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    Yes but it was the outcome of the matter .

    As for when I got them ?
    Well in all seriousness , no , not really , I didn't sit and think "oh , I have a big dog so I'd better be ready to cop more than a little dog does if he gets in to any trouble".
    Yeah I'm the same, lol I doubt anyone that gets a pet would weight up risks like that because it is the last thing they expect to happen. I know both of my dogs could do damage to a SWF's so I keep them away from those type of dogs.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  8. #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadielee87 View Post
    Yeah I'm the same, lol I doubt anyone that gets a pet would weight up risks like that because it is the last thing they expect to happen.
    But they should? And if all dog owners were educated on the risks and how to negate them and follow through on that, we wouldn't have a problem at all.

  9. #269

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    But that's still pandering to the 'nanny state' we have become and is also still going against logical thinking in my opinion Beloz.

    I don't expect every new pet owner out there to sit and weigh up the 'what if' risks. There are a few that go hand in hand with pet ownership of course but that comes under common sense ( which we all know is not that common)

    The factor of a big dog will do way more damage than a little dog and I'll get into heaps of crap for it but if I get a little dog then I wont get into as much trouble.....is just...well....I just dont see any logic at all.

    If anything , it is still playing into BSL hands using 'breed' factors again.
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  10. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    But that's still pandering to the 'nanny state' we have become and is also still going against logical thinking in my opinion Beloz.

    I don't expect every new pet owner out there to sit and weigh up the 'what if' risks. There are a few that go hand in hand with pet ownership of course but that comes under common sense ( which we all know is not that common)

    The factor of a big dog will do way more damage than a little dog and I'll get into heaps of crap for it but if I get a little dog then I wont get into as much trouble.....is just...well....I just dont see any logic at all.

    If anything , it is still playing into BSL hands using 'breed' factors again.
    Yeah, we have developed our little ozzy nanny state where every helicopter parent hovers over their darling child and ensures that the child never takes a risk and never develops good hand/eye coordination or an understanding of the possible consequences of their actions. I find it quite disgusting that some dog owners genuinely believe that as they own little dogs, they somehow don't have to take responsibility for them. More so, if some dog "experts" state that owners of little dogs shouldn't be expected to have the same level of responsibility as that of the owners of large dogs, then these "experts" are just giving the owners of small dogs permision to behave irresponsibly.

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

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