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Thread: OMG my next door neighbor has bought a red nosed pit bull!!!!

  1. #151

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    Quote Originally Posted by mymatejack View Post
    Mosh, I suggest you read "The Lost Dogs" the Michael Vick story, it will open your eyes to the real facts of the APBT.
    Hi Mymatejack,

    The only fact we need to know is this: Is the average pitbull trustworthy around other dogs, yes or no?
    Last edited by Mosh; 12-12-2012 at 08:06 PM.

  2. #152

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosh View Post
    Hi Mymatejack,

    The only fact we need to know is this: Is the average pitbull trustworthy around other dogs, yes or no?
    Is the average APBT that has been brought up in a responsible manner trustworthy around other dogs? Yes! There will be a small percentage that no matter how much socialisation is provided will simply never get on with other dogs, but the percentage wouldn't be significantly higher than many other breeds - exactly the same as the SBT. That is why i directed you to the Michael Vick story, the vast majority of those dogs, who were not only specifically bred to fight but also trained specifically to fight, were able to be rehabilitated into not only normal household pets but therapy dogs also in some cases. I know you are a very knowledgeable person when it comes to dogs and training, i am very surprised at your stance on these type of dogs.

  3. #153

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    You're splitting hairs. The injuries pitbulls inflict on each other in the ring are horrific, their teeth saw into muscle and bone, and if these injuries were inflicted on other dogs they would most likely be fatal. It's not always fatal to another APBT because they are designed to take massive amounts of punishment and to fight for hours.

    On average a fighting dog can survive about 5 or 6 fights before being killed in the ring. Deaths are frequent and are considered to be a normal part of the dogfighting "sport".
    First they dont saw they put a puncture because unlike other dogs they are designed to hold on not bite tear release bite tear etc. Where do you get your information? 5-6 fights then get killed in the ring? You go to any country where fighting is still legal and you can see how much care is put into the dogs. When two dogs are in the ring if one turns it head, or tries to jump a wall they break up the fight and give the dog that turned a chance to cross back over if he doesnt want too the match is called and the dogs are vetted up. The dogs are not forced to put in any more effort that they want too.

    So is the only difference between a pitbull and AmStaff the temperament towards other dogs? If so, why would we allow pitbulls to continue existing in their current state of dog aggression? Why isn't it considered an undesirable trait that they can't be trusted around other dogs?
    No its not actually here are the differences

    Size Am staff are significantly larger

    Drive Am Staffs will not generally give you as much as a APBT in weight pulling which is a sport I enjoyed The drive of an Am staff is so much lower than an APBT they just dont give you as much effort and will quit a task faster

    Fad breeding Am Staffs are all about what color is in fashion breeders will breed for a color (not all I know) without any thought to work-ability, temperament or conformation. APBT breeders breed more for performance, temperament and drive

    Good on you, like I said you've got a right to enjoy the breed and keep it (as long as you're able to control it 100%), but it's still illogical for you to claim that the breed is better than other breeds and somehow "safe". The fact is that you have to take steps to keep them away from other dogs, and in my opinion this is not healthy or normal for a dog to want to attack other members of its species. In a society where dogs are running around everywhere and more than 40% of families own a dog, it's a liability to breed one that can't be trusted not to fight other dogs. It's not a companion you can take wherever you like.
    I would rather have to take steps to keep my dog away from other dogs than have to figure out how to keep it away from my kids or other humans

    How many ADBA registered APBTs have been involved in fatal attacks on other dogs? I would be willing to bet that it is not a small number.
    Are you talking about dogs that are not owned by the same person? I would bet a very small number. I raised them for many years and never not once ever did one of my dogs get a hold of another animal, we went to shows almost every weekend and I never saw an episode with an APBT now I did see a border terrier tear into another dog, I saw a standard poodle attack a judge, I saw a rottie send another dog rushing to the vet, I saw a JRT jump up and tear a judges face but strangely enough never saw an incident with an APBT or Am Staff ever.

    What lack of understanding? What ignorance? Every single pitbull website and even the people who argue as its proponents, say that it is not trustworthy and cannot be allowed around other dogs or off lead. In my opinion deliberately breeding a dog that cannot form a healthy pack relationship with other dogs is a cruel and unnecessary thing to do. Deliberately breeding a dog to have such a strong drive to fight that it makes it untrustworthy, is a cruel and unnecessary thing to do.
    There is something called being careful. See if a rottie, or lab or any other breed takes after another dog its somehow ok, but if a APBT does it very bad APBT owners have to protect their dogs from people who dont understand if there is an accident.
    Last edited by Greys4me; 12-12-2012 at 11:20 PM.

  4. #154

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    Sorry, too tired to continue this discussion tonight ( well this morning) so will see you all on the morrow
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosh View Post
    I would have no problem with APBT's if all their breeders made a concerted effort to breed out the aggression and turn the breed into a trustworthy multipurpose companion dog. However the vast majority of the time people breed for appearance only, which means the aggressive traits stay right where they are.
    The problem is, due to BSL we do not have any reputable breeders breeding APBT's any more. Just BYB's doing it for money. Maybe if we could get the laws overturned, get some good examples of the APBT to breed from again there would be some quality dogs coming out.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  6. #156

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    Mosh I'm having a really hard time understanding your 'logic' concerning this breed. For example , you keep stating it's cruel and unethical to be breeding APBT because they are just dog killers with no other place in society.

    Well with that logic , what about the breeds that are bred to be human aggressive ?

    It sounds as if the only experience/knowledge you have of the APBT is negative,media driven myths and I say that with all respect .
    I have many friends that have 'packs' of Pits living in the home and most of my friends have at least two. Most of these dogs can co exist with other dogs in the family enviroment quite happily. Yes they may be not as dog friendly outside the home but the APBT isn't unique in this trait.

    Are they prone to DA? Yes.
    Can they lead happy , stable lives interacting with other dogs? Of course they can.

    My Pit girl was killed by none other than the good old Aussie icon,the blue cattle dog . Did it make national news? Nope. Did it make local news? Nope. Did it make it at least to the local paper? Sort of,but breeds wern't mentioned....wonder why that was ?

    And on the flip side by the way , even if this breed were completely untrustworthy around other dogs. It does not make it cruel to continue to breed them. They would still live happy , useful lives within its own family unit. So bluddy what if they cant go to a dog park? I hate the places anyway. Most people I know dislike dog parks. They are very often nothing but a smelter box of fools and accidents just waiting to happen.

    Not having a dog friendly breed is certainly not a reason for it to be wiped away.
    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  7. #157
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    time for a group hug yet?........ bags not standing infront of sean........
    Quote Originally Posted by Sean View Post
    I love 2 things in this world. Spandex and reyzor... not necessarily in that order.

  8. #158

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    *coffee splurt*

    GageDesign Pet Photography
    Site still in construction so will post link when it's finished.

  9. #159
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    I'm sure Sean wouldn't mind Reyzor!

    Great post Choppa!

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  10. #160
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    Am I the only one who's over this topic?
    Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
    I second Reyzor's suggestion - time for a group hug ...

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