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Thread: OMG my next door neighbor has bought a red nosed pit bull!!!!

  1. #141

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    All I can really say further on this matter is that no matter what argument we put forward , no matter what personal experiences we share here , I believe that Mosh has their mind made up thoroughly on the APBT .

    To state things such as " Shouldn't we be able to recognize that it's cruel to breed an animal that wants to kill members of its own species?" is quite ignorant in my opinion and does nothing but in fact show the amount of lack of understanding some people have for this breed.

    No dog wants to kill any other dog it see's. Even heavily bred game dogs put in a box wont fight to the 'death' . Beaten dogs will attempt to back off,to stop the fight. It is how winners/champions were decided. However,what the generation of today does is something quite different,with a totally different class of dog.
    Problem is , whilst they call them APBT , 99 percent of them certainly are not.
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  2. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    All I can really say further on this matter is that no matter what argument we put forward , no matter what personal experiences we share here , I believe that Mosh has their mind made up thoroughly on the APBT .

    To state things such as " Shouldn't we be able to recognize that it's cruel to breed an animal that wants to kill members of its own species?" is quite ignorant in my opinion and does nothing but in fact show the amount of lack of understanding some people have for this breed.

    No dog wants to kill any other dog it see's. Even heavily bred game dogs put in a box wont fight to the 'death' . Beaten dogs will attempt to back off,to stop the fight. It is how winners/champions were decided. However,what the generation of today does is something quite different,with a totally different class of dog.
    Problem is , whilst they call them APBT , 99 percent of them certainly are not.

    You know the sad part of all this is the APBT reputation is being destroyed as a direct result of animal welfare groups making up lies about dog fighting thus throwing the public into panic mode. Totally made up things that were not in the sport until the human societies said there were so then these thugs started using bait animals thus making people think worse of the dogs.

    Bait dogs lie

    Test dogs -truth yes dogmen involved in the game had test dogs these were dogs that would push the dog being tested to see if the dog would try to jump the wall or turn and refuse to scratch (go back for more) These tests were not long drawn out fights. An good dogman in the day would never ever let a a APBT attack another dog breed or lesser animal they found it inhumane and cruel.

    Feeding fighting dogs cats

    Feeding them gun powder

    Let them fight to death

    Kept them on short chains and stand in poop


    What people dont realize is these men took way better care of their dogs than many families take care of dogs now. The thugs are not doing right by the dog but most of that is because they read these lies about how dog fighters treated and trained their dogs and are not doing this. Really unless someone has known a dogman they shoudl speak on what they do to the dogs this would really help the rep a bit.

  3. #143
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    My OH kindly told me yesterday a guy he works with told them that his mate breeds APBT and fights them in my local area and uses goats as bait.

    I've seen the result of plenty of dogs that have been used as bait. They may have done things differently back in the day, they certainly don't now.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  4. #144

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    Quote Originally Posted by jadielee87 View Post
    My OH kindly told me yesterday a guy he works with told them that his mate breeds APBT and fights them in my local area and uses goats as bait.

    I've seen the result of plenty of dogs that have been used as bait. They may have done things differently back in the day, they certainly don't now.
    yeah thats the sad part WTH is a goat going to teach a dog about fighting these people are idiots and cruel. Hopefully the government can get a hold of these people and castrate them.

  5. #145

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    There are people like this actually they are in jail and many times get out to offend again.
    So what if someone had deliberately made them like this? How would we label the people who designed other people to want to commit homicidal violence?


    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    Actually they were not bred to kill each other that is something that humane societies put in peoples heads, yes they did get hurt and would rarely die from injuries but the point wasnt to have 2 dogs fight to the death.
    You're splitting hairs. The injuries pitbulls inflict on each other in the ring are horrific, their teeth saw into muscle and bone, and if these injuries were inflicted on other dogs they would most likely be fatal. It's not always fatal to another APBT because they are designed to take massive amounts of punishment and to fight for hours.

    On average a fighting dog can survive about 5 or 6 fights before being killed in the ring. Deaths are frequent and are considered to be a normal part of the dogfighting "sport".


    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    Oh you haven't seen some of the JRTs I have seen but being a vet tech and dog trainer we get to see a lot more than the average person. I love JRT dont get me wrong but they are a much higher liability than APBTs.
    I've seen dozens of JRT's and none of them were dangerous around other dogs. The worst a dog would get from a JRT is barked at and maybe its legs nipped. To say that they are a higher liability than APBT's is to go back on everything you've said about not being able to trust them not to fight, and not being able to have them around other dogs. There is no warning on any JRT club sites about not being able to trust them not to fight, and never letting them off lead. With the right discipline training they are totally trustworthy and will walk nicely off lead. It says something when the lovers of the APBT breed will acknowledge that they can't be trusted no matter how much training they are given.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    People did and they are called AM Staffs which you can see again not as many passed as APBT. Why do I like the breed? Easy they are far superior to any other breed with my children. They are awesome with people this is why I like them, they are not a large dog (mine ran 28-35 pounds), easy to groom and keep clean. Have determination like no other breed of dog I have known they are beautiful.
    So is the only difference between a pitbull and AmStaff the temperament towards other dogs? If so, why would we allow pitbulls to continue existing in their current state of dog aggression? Why isn't it considered an undesirable trait that they can't be trusted around other dogs?


    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    So what happens when a person JRT off leash runs into a cat and catches it then kills it? See here is where you are missing my point there should be no reason to have to fight off a crazed APBT they should not under any circumstances want to harm a human. If they do its easy solution destroy the dog and move on. We have to set very high standards with the APBT if it acts funny with a human it goes down, no ifs and or butts because this breed is suppose to be rock solid with humans.
    Not high enough - they are still dog aggressive and will continue to be until it's bred out of them. And if a JRT kills a cat this is not unhealthy or abnormal behaviour for a dog - the cat is a different species and thus an acceptable part of the prey drive. You can teach a dog to be safe around cats, but it's not going to adversely affect the dog's mental health if it thinks cats are fast food. I would argue that keeping a dog isolated from other dogs is not at all good for its mental health. They are pack animals and need to form relationships with each other without the involvement of humans.


    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    I dont care about my dogs running around with fluffy and having a good time though. I dont feel the need to show off a APBT at dog parks, I am happy enjoying the dogs showing them, going to the beach with them, doing weight pull with them having them cuddle with the children at night.
    Good on you, like I said you've got a right to enjoy the breed and keep it (as long as you're able to control it 100%), but it's still illogical for you to claim that the breed is better than other breeds and somehow "safe". The fact is that you have to take steps to keep them away from other dogs, and in my opinion this is not healthy or normal for a dog to want to attack other members of its species. In a society where dogs are running around everywhere and more than 40% of families own a dog, it's a liability to breed one that can't be trusted not to fight other dogs. It's not a companion you can take wherever you like.


    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    I would guess the number of ADBA registered APBTs involved in an attack on a human is little to none. These "pit bulls" involved in attacks are usually some sort of mix and that is really unfair. I would like to see the registration papers on these attacks because most are just mutts being labeled because they have big heads. I am not talking about some backyard bred mutt I am talking about real registered APBT I wish they would just change the name because then people can have their crazy mutts call them pit bulls to look tough and then the APBT can be renamed it would save a lot of confusion
    How many ADBA registered APBTs have been involved in fatal attacks on other dogs? I would be willing to bet that it is not a small number.

  6. #146

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    Hi Mosh,

    What's your opinion of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier?

  7. #147

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    All I can really say further on this matter is that no matter what argument we put forward , no matter what personal experiences we share here , I believe that Mosh has their mind made up thoroughly on the APBT .
    I'm not really interested in personal experiences, since they don't represent the majority or the average. Unless you can tell me that the average APBT can be safely left alone unsupervised with other dogs, then yes I have made up my mind based on the information I have.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    To state things such as " Shouldn't we be able to recognize that it's cruel to breed an animal that wants to kill members of its own species?" is quite ignorant in my opinion and does nothing but in fact show the amount of lack of understanding some people have for this breed.
    What lack of understanding? What ignorance? Every single pitbull website and even the people who argue as its proponents, say that it is not trustworthy and cannot be allowed around other dogs or off lead. In my opinion deliberately breeding a dog that cannot form a healthy pack relationship with other dogs is a cruel and unnecessary thing to do. Deliberately breeding a dog to have such a strong drive to fight that it makes it untrustworthy, is a cruel and unnecessary thing to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChoppaChop View Post
    No dog wants to kill any other dog it see's. Even heavily bred game dogs put in a box wont fight to the 'death' . Beaten dogs will attempt to back off,to stop the fight. It is how winners/champions were decided. However,what the generation of today does is something quite different,with a totally different class of dog.
    Problem is , whilst they call them APBT , 99 percent of them certainly are not.
    Whether or not that may be the case, the fact remains that APBT's cannot be trusted around other dogs because of the risk of injury or death. There aren't many dogs that could survive an attack by a pitbull.

    So I ask again - why are there armies of people who claim to be dog lovers, but who spend their time claiming that the most dog aggressive dog is the "best breed"? Why is it that APBT's continue to be bred with a strong drive to fight, if the breeders don't want them to fight? It doesn't make sense.
    Last edited by Mosh; 12-12-2012 at 07:59 PM.

  8. #148

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    Mosh, I suggest you read "The Lost Dogs" the Michael Vick story, it will open your eyes to the real facts of the APBT.

  9. #149
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    OMG my next door neighbor has bought a "substitute your own Breed" because the breed doesn't matter as any breed in the wrong hands can be dangerous. People are quick to blame the breed, especially the Media who just love dog attack stories and of cause journos are experts on dog breeds aren't they.

    Pollies who haven't got a clue ban certain breeds thinking this will fix the problem, but it's always the Irresponsible moronic owners who are the problem why can't people see this. People are killed in cars every year, do we ban cars.

    Any one can buy a dog of any breed whether they know anything about it or not, keep it on a chain with no human contact bash it and if the dog happens to be of a certain breed ( APBT,Rottie, GSD ) gets out and bites someone well the pollies, Media and every other Idiot blames the breed - What a Bloody joke.
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  10. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by mymatejack View Post
    Hi Mosh,

    What's your opinion of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier?
    They are apparently the breed of dog most likely to bite humans in Australia. If this is true, I expect the reason there aren't many fatalities is because they're too small to do fatal damage. I personally have no problem if someone wants to own one and they're capable of taking care of it, but I've had a lot of contact with a lot of staffies and they are intense little buggers. I looked after a staffy duo a couple of years ago and they would get so obsessed with tugging at the ball or a stick they'd chew each others lips until they bled all over each other. However even those two would not properly attack each other or any other dog, and they could be walked off lead reasonably reliably.

    Staffies have not been specifically bred for pit fighting in the last century and as such their drive to fight has been watered down. Most of them are pretty much a mongrel breed. They're now classified as an "all-purpose dog" which I think fits the bill. Unlike the APBT, they are not untrustworthy around other dogs by default although their temperament varies widely.

    I would have no problem with APBT's if all their breeders made a concerted effort to breed out the aggression and turn the breed into a trustworthy multipurpose companion dog. However the vast majority of the time people breed for appearance only, which means the aggressive traits stay right where they are.

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