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Thread: OMG my next door neighbor has bought a red nosed pit bull!!!!

  1. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by smithmoir View Post
    I'm with you Mosh. A "pit bull" is just fine - and no problem at all... just a dog.
    Until the moment it ISN'T... then it's a bloody disaster.

    When it all goes wrong it goes TERRIBLY wrong. Then what?

    Everyone says their dog is wonderful, wouldn't hurt a fly, has never attacked anything.
    They all are like that... until the day they DO attack. THEN WHAT?

    Everybody's "really sorry, can't understand it, he's never done that
    before... , , ". By then it's all way too late.

    Dog owners should be held accountable for dog attacks. Maybe if they
    faced big fines if their dog attacked anything, people might think twice
    about owning these kinds of dogs
    Which kind of dogs? Labrodors? Rottweilers? German Shepards?

    oh you mean pitbulls? lol

    Have a look at the actual stats and then form an opinion, 2 fatalities since 1979 by pitbulls out of 33 dog attack fatalities in Australia

  2. #122

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    Originally Posted by Mosh
    If your neighbours are terrified of your dogs, it sounds like they would not be able to handle a pitbull. Despite what people may say, a pitbull is not "just a dog", they require a LOT of effort, exercise, and training, and even then it will not be 100% trustworthy around children and other dogs. When the pro-pitbull website run by people who love pitbulls says "never trust your pitbull not to fight", you know that this is not a breed that makes a good house pet. I understand your concern and I would be just as concerned in your position.
    Ok Ill start here I do not agree or condone dog fighting. I am talking about the whole but there are some dogs that this wont be true about.

    I raised and showed American Pit Bull Terriers for many years. This is the only breed that I have ever trusted 100% with my children. "never trust a pit bull not to fight" is in regards to other animals, not human beings. Just because an dog is dog aggressive does not mean it is people aggressive. APBTs were bred to fight yes but they were also bred to be human friendly, meaning if they were aggressive towards humans they were culled (there are a few famous fighting dogs that were human aggressive and lived but that was a rarity not norm) So lets go back to the dog fighting days, 3 men and 2 dogs are in a pit and all the time the dogs are fighting the owners have to be able to handle them, breaking them apart, cheering them on even getting face to face to the dogs, if this breed was unstable around humans do you think these people would be able to do this?

    If two APBTs are fighting you can just grab them and break it up, they do not have redirected aggression problems most dogs if hyped up or fighting if you try to grab them you are going to get nailed. Yes these dogs were bred for many generations to fight other dogs, but they were also bred for many generations to not EVER bite a human. That said when they banned dog fighting they leaked out to the general public and have gone down hill because of bad owners NOT because they are a bad breed. When dog fighting was legal you had to work really hard to prove to the breeders you were worthy to own this breed, sadly now they are a dime a dozen and people want to look tough so they got popular.


    As far as a APBT being just another dog, well they are dogs but they are not like other dogs they take a lot of work and being very careful but in the right hands they are awesome. When you own a APBT you have to be responsible, never let it off leash, dont go to dog parks, watch for signs that they may pick fights and avoid it, if they dont like dogs dont force it your asking for trouble. Just like greyhounds you wouldnt take a greyhound to a place where there will be small animals running around and let it off leash. Other breeds have things you have to be careful with. JRTs may turn around one day and kill your cat or small pet. DOgs are bred usually for a purpose and when they act on that purpose dont blame the dog blame the owner that wasnt diligent enough to know this and protect the dog from failing.
    I am sure there is more as I read this thread but wanted to put that there.
    Last edited by Greys4me; 12-10-2012 at 09:26 PM.

  3. #123

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beloz View Post
    You are not supposed tot trust any dog 100% around kids (which is why the experts' advice is to always supervise!) I don't know where you got the impression that PBTs are less trustworthy with kids than other dogs? These dogs used to be called "nanny dogs" for god's sake! And you can never trust any dog not to fight! It's not because you read it on a pro-PBT website that it is specific to that breed.

    Your opinion does not at all seem based on facts. Which kind of surprises me from you, to be honest.

    And I don't know about anyone else, but I really don't like people calling them red-nosed pit bulls. As if it is some dangerous variety of the breed or something? Don't they all have red noses anyway? Why mention it?

    PS: I don't own a pitbull nor do any of my friends (though one is fostering a possible pitbull x).
    No they dont all have red noses, there are many different colors of American Pit Bull Terriers. Red nose is a color not a breed

  4. #124

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    My opinion is based on the fact that the pitbull is a fighting breed. Breeds that are designed to fight and guard, are more likely to be territorial and aggressive. I've seen a lot of emotional arguments that pitbulls are the most wonderful dogs ever, and the opposing view that they are the most dangerous and vicious dogs, but none of these arguments have convinced me.
    This simply isnt true. Non of my dogs were territorial, yes they wanted to fight each other but that was because that is how they are designed not because they were aggressive or territorial.

    I knew an old man who raised APBTs pre dog fighting bans and he often had dogs that he fought and then they would lay around with the cats and other dogs but when they saw a dog across the mat from them they were ready to fight. Does that sound like an unstable dog to you or does it sound like a dog that knew what he was suppose to do and when.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by mymatejack View Post
    Which kind of dogs? Labrodors? Rottweilers? German Shepards?

    oh you mean pitbulls? lol

    Have a look at the actual stats and then form an opinion, 2 fatalities since 1979 by pitbulls out of 33 dog attack fatalities in Australia
    2 fatalities by pitbulls in Australia? Not as far as I am aware. The recent awful death of Ayen Chol was attributed to a "pitbull/mastiff" cross and the death in NSW a few years ago was attributed to a "pit bull". Show me the breed papers or the DNA evidence and then I might tend to believe you.

    Linda Watson of Monash University (and former head of the Endangered Dog Breeds Association) states that of the 33 deaths in Australia since 1979, 2 have been attributed to mongrels who may be part pit bull.

    Breed blame-game: banning Pit Bulls won’t work - Monash University

    Hyacinth and others on this thread have pointed out that there are probably next to no pure bred american Pit Bull Terriers left in Australia (except for pure bred American Staffordshire Terriers LOL!)

    I think pitbulls in Australia - are a bit like tasmanian tigers. Extinct.

    What we have left are dogs that sometimes look a bit like a pitbull - but they're more like proto-dog ie what you get when you have multigeneration bitsas bull breeds and mastiff mixes.
    (Hyacinth 09-07-2012, 05:03 PM )

    However, I personally know of one dog breeder in Western Australia who has a breeding pair of papered American Pit Pull Terriers. These dogs are getting old now and they still produce litters but not for very much longer. Unless this breeder gets into 'line breeding' (another term for in-breeding LOL), this line will end soon. That is a pity, and I'd recommend that this breeder friend of mine buys one or two pure bred and registered American Staffordshire Terriers from a reputable Australian AST breeder that does not breed hippopotamus AmStaffs. Then breed them to some of their pure bred APBTs.

    In the US of A, when the AmStaff breed stock was getting poorly they opened their breed registers in 1977 to the American Pit Bull Terrier to get a much needed injection of fresh blood; I think that it is ironic that here in Australia the few remaining APBT breeders might have to do the same by interbreeding with AmStaffs.

    Of course, there is another way to maintain the quality of pure bred APBTs in Australia without resorting to inter-breeding with AmStaffs; this way is legal under Commonwealth laws and I have been told that some here are doing it. However, it is fantastically expensive and takes a lot of effort and perseverance.

    Too hard for me, so I go back to my post of 11-27-2012, 08:49 PM to Peter70; get an AmStaff from a breeder that understands that this breed is made of equal parts of terrier and bull dog.

    And on that whole 'red nose pitty' thing; if I had a pit bull type dog with a red nose and I lived in Victoria, I'd be getting together a big bag of the best high value dog treats and taking my red nose pitty down to to my local tattoo parlour (tatts are painful, and especially if you are going to get your red nose pitty's nose tattooed black). And then I'd say 'hello' to my new staffy/mastiff' cross. And if I'd been unfortunate enough to register my dog as an American Pit Bull Terrier before these awful laws came in, I'd notify my dog as missing. Then I'd notify the council that I'd found my dog's body on the side of the road and I'd shovelled him into a garbage bag. 2 or 3 months later, I'd register my new dog; my black nose staffy/mastiff cross.

    If dodgy panel beaters can rebirth a totalled car, then ethical dog owners shouldn't have too much difficulty rebirthing one of these magnificent dogs.

    I am what I am; I love this breed like I love breathing. If/when I win Lotto, I will go down the fantastically expensive route semi described above and start legally importing pure bred American Pit Bull Terriers into Australia.

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

  6. #126

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    Line breeding isnt exactly inbreeding

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greys4me View Post
    Line breeding isnt exactly inbreeding
    True, but it is close; when you start breeding a pup to his dam and all your breeding stock are either siblings or first cousins, then your gene pool is nothing better than a dirty puddle. I guess the old joke is "line-breeding is what I do to maintain this magnificent lineage, but in-breeding is what you other breeders do to destroy our breed".

    I am not a dog breeder but I do have tertiary qualifications in the biological sciences and I understand that a tiny breed pool does not augur well for a species or sub-set of that species. I fear the outcome for any breed where there are only 1 or 2 breeding pairs being bred. And from what I know, that is the situation here in WA. I know of 1 breeder personally, and I have been told there are two other breeders here that are breeding pure bred APBTs. Of course, go into any front bar of any hotel here and you will find someone who can sell you a 'pure bre APBT' of Jeep lineage whose sire is a three times champion. And it will have a red nose, cos all real pittys have red noses don't they?

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

  8. #128
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    Because of Irresponsible owners APBT's are a restricted breed, but this doesn't stop dog attacks. The people who caused the breed to be banned just move on to another breed, the reason why BSL will never work.
    Chloe & Zorro
    Rottweilers and German Shepherds are Family

  9. #129

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    Quote Originally Posted by ricey View Post
    True, but it is close; when you start breeding a pup to his dam and all your breeding stock are either siblings or first cousins, then your gene pool is nothing better than a dirty puddle. I guess the old joke is "line-breeding is what I do to maintain this magnificent lineage, but in-breeding is what you other breeders do to destroy our breed".

    I am not a dog breeder but I do have tertiary qualifications in the biological sciences and I understand that a tiny breed pool does not augur well for a species or sub-set of that species. I fear the outcome for any breed where there are only 1 or 2 breeding pairs being bred. And from what I know, that is the situation here in WA. I know of 1 breeder personally, and I have been told there are two other breeders here that are breeding pure bred APBTs. Of course, go into any front bar of any hotel here and you will find someone who can sell you a 'pure bre APBT' of Jeep lineage whose sire is a three times champion. And it will have a red nose, cos all real pittys have red noses don't they?

    ricey

    true you have to bring in new blood
    Well then they arnt pure jeep they dont have red noses, must have some redboy or Jocko in there. I sure hope if people are truly breeding these lines they are very careful of where they place the dogs. This lines are not for the faint of heart and not for your typical dog owner if they are truly the lines they say they are.

    next they will be selling pure red nose colby's

    Because of Irresponsible owners APBT's are a restricted breed, but this doesn't stop dog attacks. The people who caused the breed to be banned just move on to another breed, the reason why BSL will never work.
    IMO most of the fault is on the breeders who sell these dogs to the irresponsible owners if the breeder hadnt sold the dog then there would be such a large problem. That and they are breeding too much I raised and showed APBTs for 10 years and in that time I bred 2 litters and studded out my dogs 2 times for a total of 4 litters.
    Last edited by Greys4me; 12-11-2012 at 08:01 PM.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dogman View Post
    Because of Irresponsible owners APBT's are a restricted breed, but this doesn't stop dog attacks. The people who caused the breed to be banned just move on to another breed, the reason why BSL will never work.
    Yep, that is true; I am guessing that the next restricted breed will be Akitas or possibly huskies. I am old enough to have been alive when the only restricted breed in Australia was the German Shepherd (or Alsatian as they were called then). Back in the sixties, if a young thug wanted a tough dog, he would get a German Shepherd. Later, Dobermanns and rottweilers become the canine weapon accessory that any would be crimmo slimebag aspired to. So, dobes, rotties and sheps; some of the best dogs I know are members of these breeds. Then again, 3 rottweilers and a rottweiler cross ate Mrs Perina Chokolich in her veggie garden back in 1995 here in Perth. Thing is, all dogs of all breeds can (and sometimes do) bite.

    As Dogman points out, the common denominator is the irresponsible owner (in Mrs Chokolich's case, it was alleged to be Giovanni Pacino, 35, who was convicted of manslaughter in 1998 and sentenced to three years' jail - this conviction was subsequently overturned). It is too easy for lazy pollies to legislate against dog breeds when the problem is not the dog (or dog breed) but the owner. Dogs and dog breeds don't vote, so why should a pollie give a rat's arse about a dog?

    The more I know about people, the more I admire and respect my dogs.

    ricey
    The APBT is the best of the best dogs (but it is just a dog, like any other breed of dog)

    My avatar? It's a pit bull in a poodle suit (a bit like me really)

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