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Thread: Entering into breeding and want every scrap of advice

  1. #61
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    "Maybe you should take a walk through your local pound and see the problems BYB's like yourself cause - then come back and tell us you're breeding mutts cause you love animals. Whatever, i'm done."

    Ho hum, what a childish, immature response. Glad at least some people on here are willing to give genuine advice and not just judge. Didn't know you were an expert on what defines a mutt and what doesn't. Purebreds don't have to be papered, they could be from a strain that just wasn't documented, but don't let me sway you from the opinion that she's a 'mutt' from one picture. Also, don't be putting words in my mouth (that I never said) - I didn't say I was breeding because I love animals - show me where I said that? Nice comprehension skills there.


    Kalacreek and Kristy.Maree - you have both given me food for thought. I'm torn - I want to, but I want to do the right thing too. Half of me wants to wait but half wants to breed (now). Rebel is staying in the line for sure, when he'll be used is anyone's guess..before he becomes infertile though. Bonnie..ehh. I need to think on it for a bit.

  2. #62
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    Make sure you really think it through before you do anything, just remember you are bringing more than one new life into this world so it's something that has to be thought about greatly.. just like having a human baby. Rebel is only young so there is no hurry, I would keep busy doing agility etc. with him and then in a few years look into getting a papered bitch and go from there.

    Once you turn 18, and start being able to go out to bars/clubs, get your own car, get distracted with boyfriends, work/study etc, then you may not have time for breeding, it's best to wait a few years and see how things work out.

  3. #63
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    I will, I know it's a huge responsibility and I intend to look after all avenues as best I can. I've mentioned it briefly with my vet, I'll speak with him for longer about it too. I may end up breeding her in time - with more research and a lot of vet consultation - so I'm not saying a solid yes or no at this point. Like I said it's all up in the air. As far as turning 18 and the responsibilities goes, I have a boyfriend already, I'll be taking a gap year next year so I can have the time to take care of a single litter, and I'm gonna have a car in a few weeks - I wouldn't do it if I didn't have time. But nevertheless, I will take into account your advice.

    I'm wondering - if you have a breeder's permit, can you have more than two dogs? Because then I could still breed Rebel and own the new bitch while still having Bonnie (because getting rid of either isn't an option now or ever).

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristy.Maree View Post
    Search all dogs have a look at that link (if it works). Currently there are 3238 dogs looking for new homes, and that's the lucky ones, imagine how many have been PTS at pounds, shot by owners etc. Not to mention all the ones that aren't advertised on that website or that are still waiting for desexing, testing etc before being advertised.

    I'd willingly say that the majority of the 3238 dogs were bred by people thinking that they were doing the right thing, breeding unpapered dogs and having 'just one litter'. Nobody ever wants the puppies that they bred to end up homeless, but it obviously happens. Your heart is in the right place, but there are already so many dogs wanting homes, what is bringing possibly 12 more into the world going to do? Maybe you will have homes for them all but that's up to 12 shelter dogs who will remain in cold, lonely cages because people have bought off what is essentially a BYB (not puppy farmer) instead. Go walk around a shelter before you breed, see how you feel afterwards.

    You're only 17, PLEASE wait a few more years before you consider breeding. When I was 17 I would've loved to breed my dogs too but I think you have to move out, gain responsibilities, support yourself, pay rent/a mortgage, cook/clean/entertain, gain perspective on how many homeless animals there are etc before you even start to consider bringing another live thing into this world, be it a human baby, puppies, kittens etc.

    As I said, your heart is in the right place and you're planning great future homes for your puppies but how many of those 3238 dog 'breeders' thought they were giving their dogs to great homes too...
    Thanks KM! This is what I should have written (had I the time - however playing hookey from work) and I feel that this is what MMJ means as well. 10-12 puppies, easy to place as everyone wants a cute puppy.
    7 months-1 year later some of them WILL end up in Rescue or on Gumtree.
    Do you see the same excuses on many of the ads? We don't have time for him, he needs a bigger yard, we are moving, he needs a farm.
    Sad for the dogs - they had a family who loved them, until they grew up.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by chubbsecurity View Post
    Thanks KM! This is what I should have written (had I the time - however playing hookey from work) and I feel that this is what MMJ means as well. 10-12 puppies, easy to place as everyone wants a cute puppy.
    7 months-1 year later some of them WILL end up in Rescue or on Gumtree.
    Do you see the same excuses on many of the ads? We don't have time for him, he needs a bigger yard, we are moving, he needs a farm.
    Sad for the dogs - they had a family who loved them, until they grew up.
    Definitely more common with working dogs as well as you would know! People don't realise what they are getting themselves into.

    There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadielee87 View Post
    Definitely more common with working dogs as well as you would know! People don't realise what they are getting themselves into.
    This is very true. I currently have 2 that were too much for their suburban owners and were taken to a shelter. They were going to be difficult to rehome so I was asked if I would take them. I assessed them has having potential for what I wanted so took them. They have turned out to be very good dogs. They just needed a working home and training which I can give them.

    I have also taken in the odd one as a foster and some of them have been completely untrained and off the scale in terms of high drive temperament and all but impossible to rehome. Trouble is they keep pouring in to shelters.

    Striker, 17 is very young to be making those sorts of decisions, I know that sounds a bit patronising, but I have been around dogs and involved in dogs for a very long time and I must say that it has taken many years of experiencing the highs and lows of dogs to feel that breeding is something that I would personally never undertake for many reasons.

    If you have your heart set on it I think the best thing you can do is learn heaps more about Border collies. The history of working and showbreds, the structure, the genetics and lots more. Breeding should come out of a passion for producing realy good quality healthy, sound animals that will be a pleasure to own, and also to do the right thing by your chosen breed. To achieve this there is much to learn.

  7. #67
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    instead of paying the exorbitant prices rego'd breeders charge
    rego'd breeders charge those prices - because that's what it costs them to do all the testing and get all the good vet care and hopefully their lines have proven performance in herding, agility, obedience, tracking, rescue or show... If they don't have a proven track record in the dog lines - it's not really worth spending all the money to get the tests done.

    Hip dysplasia xrays have to be done under general anaesthetic, the DNA tests are less invasive but still cost $$$ and there's no medicare for dogs.

    Personally - I wouldn't want to be homing puppies to people who want them on the cheap.

    And some of the people here who really don't want you to get started until you start to understand what they're saying - are the ones who have spent a lot of time working in rescue or pounds and know how much it sucks to have to PTS loads of healthy gorgeous natured unwanted dogs every week.

    Purebreds don't have to be papered, they could be from a strain that just wasn't documented
    Erm not really. They don't have to be ANKC registered, but if the line wasn't documented - you could be buying dingo crosses for all you know.

    And by the way in QLD - you will probably have to comply with this at some level. And that will mean not-cheap puppies too.
    http://www.daff.qld.gov.au/documents...S_MARCH-12.pdf

  8. #68
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    You are convinced your bitch should be bred despite not being correct physically. I think you simply came on here to find validation and agreement not information at all considering you have shown no interest in doing anything with your dogs or leaning what traits are actually wanted in border collies and what you will produce. You're heading down the road of producing pound fodder.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nekhbet View Post
    You are convinced your bitch should be bred despite not being correct physically. I think you simply came on here to find validation and agreement not information at all considering you have shown no interest in doing anything with your dogs or leaning what traits are actually wanted in border collies and what you will produce. You're heading down the road of producing pound fodder.
    Look, it's obvious you don't have a very high opinion of me - and to be honest I don't care - but don't delude yourself that I seek the approval of complete strangers. I sought advice, and some of the posters gave very good advice. Like I've said probably 10 times by now, if you failed to notice, was that I'd think about the advice the competent posters have given me in regards to breeding Bonnie, and I am, hence why I have little interest in this thread anymore. I've gotten all the useful information, and now it's just a matter of people posting with their own opinions and little actual advice.

    And btw, nobody truly knows where their dogs will end up, breeder or not. Having papers isn't a fail-safe against ending up in a pound - any dog can, with equal chance. The best anyone can do is question the prospective new owners considerably to make sure they get the best home they can - after the dog is sold to them, there's no rules to what they can or can't do with them, including dump them in a pound if they have to move suddenly, or can't afford the dog because of a lack of job, etc.

    Funny how I hardly ever see any pure / pure-looking border collies in the RSPCA up here - if any, most seem to be BC x kelpie/heeler/mystery dog, along with literally hundreds of pitties / pittie crosses. From what I've seen, pound fodder is generally dogs that are a mix of 2+ breeds from a breeding between someone's kelpie cross and a pitbull (example). And since the temperaments of both my dogs are excellent, I sincerely doubt they'll end up in the pound from temperamental issues.

    I've said all I need to.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Striker View Post

    And btw, nobody truly knows where their dogs will end up, breeder or not. Having papers isn't a fail-safe against ending up in a pound - any dog can, with equal chance. The best anyone can do is question the prospective new owners considerably to make sure they get the best home they can - after the dog is sold to them, there's no rules to what they can or can't do with them, including dump them in a pound if they have to move suddenly, or can't afford the dog because of a lack of job, etc.
    This is very true! Having papers doesn't mean the dog cant go to the pound! I've heard of so many papered dogs from registered breeders that end up in the pound! :/

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